View Full Version : Abortion
Behemoth
05-05-2005, 16:55
What are everybody's thoughts on abortion? I want to get some lively debate going!
I personally would never have an abortion but I don't see why other cannot have the choice.. it has been restricted here in Ireland far to long.. We can't have one but at least now we have access to information about it
Who knows what they would do in a desperate situation until they are facing it?
.:Kitz:.
05-05-2005, 17:54
exactly Shari!
I think it's up to you, its your life and your body, so if your not ready to have a baby then have an abortion. I think its proberly the hardest decision to make, but as long as you are 100% sure, i dont see what is wrong with it.
Plus, image if you were Little Mo in Eastenders and got pregnant after being raped. I think that people should be able to make the dcision not to have hte baby if they didn't want to, but be able to if they want.
Not sure if that all makes sense though...
In the vein of prevention is better than the cure I do think that education and access to contraception should be improved, and that in case of accidents etc the morning after pill should be readily available. Early chemical abortion could also be more readily available.
I do think that the time limits for abortion should be reduced to well below 26 weeks. Babies can born alive at that stage now.
Although I find the whole thing distastful I was horified that a court in Florida recently denied a pregnant 13 year old the right to an abortion on the grounds that she wasn't mature enough to make the decision. But mature enough to go through a full term pregnancy, childbirth and to either be a mother or give her child away!
That court was really out of order towards that girl.
I agree it should be lowered a great deal. By that point it could stay alive on its own, so i dont think that people should be able to kill it at that time. But i dont know when i would prefer it to be. If you lowered it by months, then there would alwasy be people that would realise they were pregnant, and hten it would be too late.
I guess that no body will agree on when the time limits should be, again i think its just down to personal opinions.
my personal opinion is that it is a womans right too chose what happens to her body, but personaly the only reason i would have an abortion is if i was raped.
When a baby can survive outside the womb then it ceases to be the mothers body. As I said I find the whole thing distasteful in the extreme. Women need to control there fertility, and if an accident happens then it should be dealt with immediately by using the morning after pill. In very early pregnancy you can use medication that causes the body to reject the fetus and it is just like having a late period.
Abortion shout take place as early as posible in the pregnancy, and definitely before 16 weeks.
Yeah i agree, though it must be hard for people to decide what to do if they find out that their child is going to be severly disabled. i dont know what i'd do then
Yep, that is a real dialema. Especially whe you have to wait until you are 20 weeks gone to get the results of amniocentisis tests. I don't know what I would do either.
di marco
05-05-2005, 20:51
if i was raped then i think that id prob have an abortion and if i had got pregnant when i was younger then i would have wanted to have one, but if i got pregnant now i dont know, i might keep it as im a bit older. and i dont really know what id do if my baby was disabled either, i dont think you know til youre in that position
I think abortion has it place,but only for certain reasons such as rape,disabled or medical.Not because you do feel like having a baby yet,or because you are to young.If you are young you should be playing adult games.we dont live in the dark ages anymore and there is such a thing as prevention. I think the time limit should be reduced to max 15 weeks.
Behemoth
05-05-2005, 22:23
Don't forget that a fetus isn't actually living on it's own untill it's born. The fetus isn't breathing in the womb, it is solely reliant on the mother to stay alive.
If I was "with child" now I do not think I could justify it to myself to have an abortion because I have a patrner who I love and enough money to provide. I think the most important thing is to be able to stand by your own decision and have no regrets about it.
If I was raped I think that would be a completely diffirent story, although I could not say what I would do until it happened (thank goodness it hasn't).
I would not judge anyone who has had an abortion, for whatever reason.
My mum was adopted, and her natural mother is a Irish women who came to England to have an abortion but couldn't go through with it....
SoapWatcher
06-05-2005, 02:03
Some people dont realise their "accident", i mean the pill isnt 100%. Theres no way of telling until you find out youre pregnant:p Happens to a lot of people.
I agree though, the abortion limit should be brought down. But i dont think you should get rid of a child just because its disabled in some way. There are lots of disabled people out there, leading happy lives.
The abortion limit, as far as I was aware was 16 weeks... I think after that there is a chance the baby can survive.. I know after 24 weeks of pregnancy a child can survive
I would never have an abortion for rape. I know to many childless couple who would love a child and I would gladly go through labour to see their happiness at me giving them a child
I thought the limit was 25 weeks? But only if there is something medically wrong with the baby?
I thought the limit was 25 weeks? But only if there is something medically wrong with the baby?
I really have no idea.. there is not much information about it in Ireland to comment.. I just assumed that they would not let you have one after 16 weeks
Its 24 weeks, some babies have been viable at 21-22 weeks so they are thinking about lowering it to 20.
Thanks for that.. I know here they are trying to get all women to have there first scans at 12 weeks so they can check for physical illness and do test if necessary before it is too late to abort
Id be intrested to here a mans point of view
Id be intrested to here a mans point of view
Yeah.. most men don't think it is there issue but I think it is too.. Overall it is the woman who has the abortion but the father of the feotus has a right too
i'm a man and i think it should really be up to the Parents of the Unborn Child to decide
i'm a man and i think it should really be up to the Parents of the Unborn Child to decide
Yes the PARENTS.. but most women have one without discussing it with anyone
SoapRach
06-05-2005, 12:50
I'm really split on the both parents thing - when I was at uni I told my boyfriend that if I got pregnant by accident that i wouldn't want it and I'd have an abortion and he was really unhappy about that - he's a bit older than me and so would have been ready to be a father - and said that he would never forgive me if i did. But having a baby would have ruined my degree which was really important to me. Luckily the pill worked and so we never had to worry about it too much. still don't know what I would have done. I think it's up to the individual - I probably wouldn't now as I'm in a secure job and although am not planning to have children just yet I could provide for one if need be.
$sTaCeY$
06-05-2005, 13:08
I would probably get an abortion if i got pergnant at my age, i'd probably get into a lot of trouble with my parents if i got pregnant
i personally couldnt have an abortion but i do think every one has a right to that option.
A agree that the limit for abortions should be reduced, at 22 weeks and above that baby could survive and you have to go through with a borth anyway there are other options when it is this late on ! So many childless couples out there a crying out for babies!
i dont agree with abortion unless something is wrong with the baby then it is a option ,im not sure what i would do in that position though.im not sure with being raped either as i know the father of your child is a rapist but it is half you too.
i fell pregnant at 16,everyone told me to abort apart from one of my sisters who was the only one to say congratulations which i have never forgotton.i didnt listen to them,they said i would have no life, no money,no house,no holidays etc etc.i am now 23 ,still with the same guy,we have 2 children,another on the way and we have money our own house we go abroad every year,disney world included in that,our own car,bought out right no finance,and the sister who tokld me i would have nothing is now heading 40 with none of those things.im glad i didnt listen to them as im sure having that little boy set the path for the rest of my life and its looking to be a good one!
i think everyone should make up their own mind, but i personally would never have an abortion. it's an innocent little baby and i believe that a baby is a baby from the moment it's conceived, not when it's organs start to form.
yes i also believe that from the moment its conceived its a baby,doesnt matter how you sugar coat it,if you hadnt have aborted it it would have grown in to a living person.
I think unless someone has been in the position to have been raped, i don't think they can comment on whether abortion is right or wrong.
I have seen some say that its still a child and it still is half of the womans child, but at the end of the day, can anyone imagine having to look at the product of the most horrible, sickening, vile time of your life???????
I am male, but i could never imagine anyone being able to go ahead with that.
I know its a child, and has a right to live, but surely the mother has the right to decide if she wants to spend all that time bringing up a child, that if honest, most would not want!
Abortion just for the sake of it, or because someone wasn't careful is a different kettle of fish, they have the choice in the first place (in most cases) so shouldn't be allowed.
But it will always be around, and it will never be banned. Once you ban something like that, you remove peoples basic human rights, and that just is not allowed.
i had my first when i was 18 and the idea of an abortion never crossed my mind. but i now know you can get pregnant the first time. as i said earlier i would probably have an abortion if i was raped but it would take a lot of thought and unless you are in that situation you never know how you will feel. i also thinl the time limit should be bought down to 16 weeks. i also agree with sherbs that abortion for the sake of it or because you were not careful should not be allowed.(in most cases)
I really dont agree with people using abortion as a kind of contraceptive
No I dont understand it either. Some people dont agree with the Morning After Pill (not as a contraceptive, just generally) as they think its an enforced miscarage or has the chance of being so.
but i guess with the morning after pill it kind of works before the sperm meets the egg, isn't that why you have to take up before 72 hours have gone? So it kinda is a contraceptive because the baby wouldn't actually have begun to form by that time would it? With abortion its a living person
mmmmm depends on your point of view really somepeople beleive that when "fertisilation" takes place thats when a fetous is formed. But it an abortion at four weeks any different as no organs or any thing is formed at this point and some may say its a collection of cells?
but does it take about 3 days the egg to be fertilised? i thought the morning after pill changed your hormone levels and stopped it getting fertilised
i might be wrong though i guess
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 22:30
The morning after pill releases large amounts of oestrogen which triggers a sequence of events which prevents the egg from developing.
I thought so
I dont have anything against this, cause its not exsisting untill its fertilised, so it doesn't kill anything it just prevents a baby forming.
I still dont think that people should just have abortions because they had an "accident", cause you should just be more careful in the first place!
Ok not sure if this is right but is what I remember from A-Level Biology,
Fertilisation can/does take place any time after "the deed" is done, this takes place in the fallopian tube.
During the week after fertilisation the fertilised egg moves down the fallopian tube and into the womb.
The fertilised egg attaches itself firmly to the womb lining and this process is called implantation.
After the fertilised egg continues to grow in the womb
So I guess it depends on when you think it becomes a life fertilisation or implantation.
Someone correct me if i'm wrong on this
So I guess it depends when you think it becomes a life, in the womb or when fertilisation takes place
The morning after pill releases large amounts of oestrogen which triggers a sequence of events which prevents the egg from developing.
But fertilisation may have already taken place. I guess it depends on your view. I dont have anything against it. I read the other day that the Morning After Pill is not offered as standard to rape victims, which I found suprising
I think it takes about 3 days between the "deed" and fertilisation, so the pill just stops it fertilising
I really dont know its confusing, the wonders of the human body!!
The morning after pill is believed to work principally by preventing your ovaries from releasing an egg, and by affecting the womb lining, so that a fertilised egg cant ‘embed’ itself there.
You can take it up to 72 hours after unprotected sex but has a higher sucesse rate if taken before 24 hours after the event. It also has a 10% faliure rate.
So do you really think it counts as abortion?
I'm kind of confused here!
I dont personally. But some people are very anti the morning after pill for the reasons above. I guess it depends on the individuals beleifs, on what you see as a "life" being created
Its not like the fertilised egg would be able to survive without being embeded in the womb, so personally i dont see it as abortion as such.
That is very true. I do think they should lower the limit from 24 weeks though as babies have been known to survive at 21-22 weeks
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:02
I think you've got that right jude! I'm doing AS Biology at the mo.
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:05
Sorry, I made a mistake before, The Morning After Pill stops implantation taking place. You were right Jude, I just read it in my biology book.
Yeah, i think that as technology gets better they should change some of these rules, cause they're a bit out dated
So its helping your revision!!! Did AS Biology but about 7 years ago!!! so a bit rusty!!
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:06
Lol yea, thanks guys!
Glad we can be of some assistance!!!
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:07
It's so confusing. There are 5 hormones involved in the menstrual cycle and they all do different things.
Dont say the word REVISION.......
Yeah, i think that as technology gets better they should change some of these rules, cause they're a bit out dated
I think your right, If i remember correctly the Abortion Act hasnt been updated since 1967 when it was implomented and technology has moved on lots since then.
You guys should watch Vera Drake its very intresting, its about a women who performed backstreet abortions in the 1950's
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:10
That film won a ton of BAFTAs
It's so confusing. There are 5 hormones involved in the menstrual cycle and they all do different things.
Yea its well complicated!!
Gonadotrophin-releasing hormone (produced in the hypothalamus, which is in the brain)
Follicle stimulating hormone (produced in the pituitary gland, which is also in the brain)
Luteinising hormone (produced in the pituitary gland)
Oestrogen (produced in the ovaries)
Progesterone (also produced in the ovaries).
Also did you know when a baby girl is born, she is born will all the eggs she will need in her whole life!!
Yeah, i'll have a look at it, when did it come out?
I went to see it at the Cinima early this year but I think its out on DVD now
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:14
My teacher calls Gonadotrophin Releasing Hormone, Human Chorionic Gonadotrophin.
My teacher calls Gonadotrophin Releasing Hormone, Human Chorionic Gonadotrophin.
????
am i suppose to laugh at a joke, or cry cause i'm confused again?
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:18
lol sorry! I was just saying that me and jude call the same hormone diffferent things but i dont get anything about it anyway lol
I went to see it at the Cinima early this year but I think its out on DVD now
Oh yeah, i remember hearing something about it now. Dont remember the BAFTAs though
It got nominated for some Oscars as well
lol sorry! I was just saying that me and jude call the same hormone diffferent things but i dont get anything about it anyway lol
Oh right... You could call it anything, it would still all be jargon for me!
Did that film actually win any oscars?
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:21
I usually call it HCG for short
I usually call it HCG for short
I still wouldn't remember it, even if you shortened it..... would you beleive i'm expected A's!!!!!!!!!! :lol:
I think it won somthing to do with costume design!!! but it was nominated for best actress and best director (well the film wasnt, but the director and actress was)
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:23
I didn't win best film did it?
Is the actual film any good?
No I think that was the Aviator
Is the actual film any good?
Its "intresting". Worth seeing
Behemoth
06-05-2005, 23:27
Ooooh yea i remember
interesting???????? hmmmm
I didn't think it had won that many big awards, otherwise i might have vaguely remembered it more
LUSHLOOKE69
19-05-2005, 00:39
i dont agree with abortion unless something is wrong with the baby then it is a option ,im not sure what i would do in that position though.im not sure with being raped either as i know the father of your child is a rapist but it is half you too.
i fell pregnant at 16,everyone told me to abort apart from one of my sisters who was the only one to say congratulations which i have never forgotton.i didnt listen to them,they said i would have no life, no money,no house,no holidays etc etc.i am now 23 ,still with the same guy,we have 2 children,another on the way and we have money our own house we go abroad every year,disney world included in that,our own car,bought out right no finance,and the sister who tokld me i would have nothing is now heading 40 with none of those things.im glad i didnt listen to them as im sure having that little boy set the path for the rest of my life and its looking to be a good one!
That's brilliant im really glad life turned out well for you but some people aren't that lucky. I relly think it depends on the situation you are in and whats right for the people involved. I was interesting in reading about the both parents deciding on the issue and I agree with this if the pregnancy occurs in a steady relationship but if a pregnancy came about from a one night stand sometimes it would be better not to tell the other party ultimately in the majority of cases it's the mother left holding the baby.
Thankfully Iv'e never been in this situation I honestly don't think you'd now what you'd do unless t happened to you!
SoapRach
19-05-2005, 12:29
interesting???????? hmmmm
I didn't think it had won that many big awards, otherwise i might have vaguely remembered it more
It won a lot at the british academy awards - It's a very british film - not full of fast moving scenes and action but it is very moving and thought provoking. I thought it was extremely well made.
I've seen it advertised in a few places recently, so i guess it must have just come out on DVD
Behemoth
19-05-2005, 16:55
Yup, it has come out on DVD. Support this site by clicking on the link above ^^ and buying it from Amazon!
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