View Full Version : is the death penalty ever justified?
give your reasons too please
CrazyLea
20-01-2006, 21:25
i dont think it is. i think its too easy a way out for people who commit crimes, they should suffer in jail not have a quick death. and also sometimes they are innocent and therefore die for no reason.. my opinions
Definetly. You take a life, or something similar, then wat gives you the right to have one. You take a life, and you lose yours. All's fair. If you dont like it, dont kill.
to me im not too sure as if soemone kille soemone then you are a murdereer by giving them the death penality so im not too sure it just doesnt make sense
Behemoth
20-01-2006, 21:53
Yes, I believe it is sometimes justified. I believe in a life for a life.
Yes for murder, child abuse offences and similar.
Yes, I believe it is sometimes justified. I believe in a life for a life.yer good point but i dont always agree with it as what if sometimes they get it wrong
Chloe O'brien
20-01-2006, 22:04
no way what do you do if you find out you have excuted the wrong person at the end of the day I think that if someone murder's someone else then they should be locked away for life without parole. If you choose to excute them then you are no better than the murder yourself. There is a young scots lad who has been on death row in america for over 20 years for a crime he has always claimed he was innocent of committing if he had pleaded guilty to the crime he could have been out on parole by now but no he has maintained his innocence and challenge the courts to either exucte him or let him free
no way what do you do if you find out you have excuted the wrong person at the end of the day I think that if someone murder's someone else then they should be locked away for life without parole. If you choose to excute them then you are no better than the murder yourself. There is a young scots lad who has been on death row in america for over 20 years for a crime he has always claimed he was innocent of committing if he had pleaded guilty to the crime he could have been out on parole by now but no he has maintained his innocence and challenge the courts to either exucte him or let him freeexactly thats what i think i mean i dont belive in 100% sure therefore ist not justified
Johnny Allen
20-01-2006, 22:20
I think it's justified, nowadays prison is like a doss house, treating criminals like royalty in some places, if someone takes away someones life they should suffer the consequences an ultimately lose their life, to me prison is an easy ride, they should have their lifes taken away from them
Carrie Bradshaw
20-01-2006, 22:29
I think that life imprisonment is much more of a punishment than the death penalty. In some ways killing them is letting them havae the easy way out - they should have to suffer for the rest of their lives in jail. There is no way people get treated like royalty in there. And even just being cut off from the rest of the world for such a long time must be really difficult.
Also, I agree with those of you who said that if they do get it wrong, they can't unkill someone - they have taken that life whether they like it or not!
Chloe O'brien
20-01-2006, 22:34
I can totally understand those people who have lost loved ones through a terrible tragedy and i think if something happened to any my loved ones i would want to kill but at the end of the day it does not bring them back. The courts need to get their heads out of the sand and fingers out of their backsides and jail these murders for life and mean it
If there is no doubt that someone took someone elses life (if they were caught in the act or there was a significant amount of witnesses) then i believe it is justified.
Chloe O'brien
20-01-2006, 22:46
how can it be justified tell me this is there anyone who could honestly flick a switch that would electrocute someone, administrate a lethal injection or even hang someone. If someone did then they would be a murderer
If its proven without any doubt that the person is guilty then yes they should use the death penalty.
Look at how many offenders that have been given light sentences for crimes and then gone on to offend again? Wasnt Sarah Paynes killer only released from prison a few weeks or months before he murdered her? In cases like that I know its impossible to tell whats going to happen in the future but if they had longer sentences to start with a lot of crimes would be prevented.
We've been having this discussion in citizenship in school and I feel that the death penalty isn't justified. Firstly your being just as bad as the murderer by killing them. What right does a member of the government or police have to decide on wether someone lives or dies? Whoever fires the gun, flicks the switch, pulls the lever or presses the button is commiting a murder. So shouldn't they be on death row for murder? I mean what they did was murder. Also isn't death really an easy way out? By dying the criminal doesn't have to face what they've done every day. By being in prison for life everyday it will haunt them. They will be traumatised by what they did. People may say that it's a life for a life, but do we really have the right to play God and choose who lives and who dies? We should be able to forgive and I know it's really impossible to forgive someone for infantacide or serial killings, but I don't see why we should kill them. In Bolivia when someone goes into prison for child abuse, the prisoners turn on them and some are even stoned to death. Imagine having to spend everyday of the next 50 years of your life being hated, tormented, spat at for what you did. Isn't that a better punishment than being killed? Killing allows them to forget, we're giving them the chance to escape what they've done. clear the slate really. I don't think that's right.
xxx
Chloe O'brien
20-01-2006, 22:56
i agree with you tamzi but the goverment and judges need to enforce this so that when someone commits murder they are locked away for life without parole
When someone murders a person and then gets sentenced to death they dont get killed in the same way as they murdered their victim, they get killed a relatively quick and humane way. I know in other countries the prison system is tough but the one in this country is laughable.
I think the punishment should match the crime.
That's true Chloe but I think the reason why life doesn't mean life is because of the money it would cost to keep murderers in prison forever. Tax would go up and people wouldn't be willing to pay so much. Death really is the cheap and easy option. What we need to decide is do we want lower taxes but to know that people are being killed at least once a week by the state? or do we want to have to pay a bit more but know that murderers are being forced to confront what they've done every day? I just don't feel that the death penalty is justified at all
xxx
or do we want to have to pay a bit more but know that murderers are being forced to confront what they've done every day? I just don't feel that the death penalty is justified at all
xxx
How naive are some people? Do you really think every single murderer, child murderer and paedophile regret what they did every single day they are in prison? NO. Most are smirking because of the light sentences theyve got. Look at the 2 baby rapists, they'll be out in less than 6 years i think, ill bet u within 2 years of him being released he will reoffend. They dont all regret what they did, some do yes, but the majority dont and they are the ones that shouldnt ever be in a position to offend again.
That's is exactly why I am saying life should mean life! Life in prison is a heck of a lot harder than being killed. In most prisons child rapists are not let off lightly. If those people didn't get 6 years in prison, if they got 50 I'm sure there lives would be a lot worse. Murder + Rape should = life instead of death. I'm not being naive thank you, I am stating that instead of killing people we should be putting in prison untill they die!
xxx
Do you not think thought that if the death penalty was brought back in it might be effective as a preventive measure for criminals?
If they think their looking at death rather than 15 years for killing someone I would expect they might just think twice about it?
Chloe O'brien
20-01-2006, 23:39
i have known people who have been murdered but it still doen't make me feel that excuting the lowlife who took their life I would rather these scumbags where forced to live in a cupboard with no contact with their families or loved ones
no-one has the right to play GOD with other peoples lives regardless of who they are or what they have done
They do get contact though.
Do you not think thought that if the death penalty was brought back in it might be effective as a preventive measure for criminals?
If they think their looking at death rather than 15 years for killing someone I would expect they might just think twice about it?
What I am trying to say is they wouldn't get 15 years. They would get LIFE! And life would life! I have studied crime rates in America in school. Having the death penalty and not hasn't made that much difference really. It's not deterring them. Life meaning life should be the sentence murderers get
xxx
Jessie Wallace
21-01-2006, 00:11
No, if you kill someone for killing someone else, it make you as bad as them!
I am sick of my hard earned money being taken by Mr Tax Man to pay for all of the peodophiles and murders and other sick people in this world to be jailed in one of the many hotels in this country, also known as prison. If they knew that their punishment would be more severe than our penal system currently is, maybe it would prevent so many offenders and reoffenders in our community.
di marco
21-01-2006, 08:42
There is a young scots lad who has been on death row in america for over 20 years for a crime he has always claimed he was innocent of committing if he had pleaded guilty to the crime he could have been out on parole by now but no he has maintained his innocence and challenge the courts to either exucte him or let him free
exactly chloe, i read in a mag that there was this person in america that insisted he was innocent but they killed him anyway then a few months afterwards they found out that he was in fact innocent
pookie1968uk
21-01-2006, 09:01
i couldnt vote as im just not sure! it would be easy to say yes but i just dont know that its as easy as saying youve killed someone so lets kill you! lots of mistakes have been made!
i dont think you should use the death penalty omly because of what was sais in my Law lesson the other day, how many murders are actually planned yeh there are but most are spare of the moment a moment of madness. So therefore putting them in prioson is enough for them 40 odd years inside and they wont klnow what to do when they are released. Killing them is the easyway out.
.:SpIcYsPy:.
21-01-2006, 14:17
I don't think it should be brought back if this is what you're asking..
It should be brought back, years ago people were hanged and later proved inoccent, but with the DNA and other improvments in dectection this should not happen now days. For the non premeditaed murders, like you have a row and push some one and they hit their head and die,((with would probably classed as manslaugther any way), and for a spur of the moment loss of control,then life in prison.Also life should mean life no parole. But for people that plan(premediated) and serial killers just hang them, why should I work and have to pay for them to live in semi luxury in prison.
I think it's justified, nowadays prison is like a doss house, treating criminals like royalty in some places, if someone takes away someones life they should suffer the consequences an ultimately lose their life, to me prison is an easy ride, they should have their lifes taken away from themyer well i can see where you are coming from prison is nothing compared to a normal life, it means that you miss out on a tone of stuff and if you are young that include marriage and babbies. ok well we all know that more money is spent on their food than school dinners but like i said prsion takes away a huge chunk of you life and thefore in prison you are making them suffer for longer. i think we sjould stick to prisons
It should be brought back, years ago people were hanged and later proved inoccent, but with the DNA and other improvments in dectection this should not happen now days. For the non premeditaed murders, like you have a row and push some one and they hit their head and die,((with would probably classed as manslaugther any way), and for a spur of the moment loss of control,then life in prison.Also life should mean life no parole. But for people that plan(premediated) and serial killers just hang them, why should I work and have to pay for them to live in semi luxury in prison.i hear what you are saying but there is awlays are chance that they could get it wrong you just never know
if tey did bring back the death penalty then i doubt verymuch that it would be hanging. I mean wasnt there a guy recently in America who has just been killed who had been on death row so long he was blind, and deaf and in a wheel chair and they still killed him. Not sure on all the facts but when a person is in tha state they should just be left to die.
Well, In circumstances like that I don't think they should, but that Isn't very common so I am still for it.
Chloe O'brien
21-01-2006, 20:55
i know that there are scumbags out there who don't deserve to live for the crimes that they have committed but i just can't agree that excuting them is the answer too wrongs don't make a right and if you are excuting them then you are committing murder as well and i could not do that
It should be brought back, years ago people were hanged and later proved inoccent, but with the DNA and other improvments in dectection this should not happen now days. For the non premeditaed murders, like you have a row and push some one and they hit their head and die,((with would probably classed as manslaugther any way), and for a spur of the moment loss of control,then life in prison.Also life should mean life no parole. But for people that plan(premediated) and serial killers just hang them, why should I work and have to pay for them to live in semi luxury in prison.
i aggree 100% woth you hazey
squillyfer
22-01-2006, 17:09
I agree too the police just dont make mistakes like they used to with dna and appeals it would be very unlikely to execute the wrong person
An eye for an eye is that right No I don't think it is even with today's modern DNA testing and the preserving of evidence every single day people are being convicted of something they didn't do how can you take a chance like that in killing someone and what does it prove that it's ok to kill the bad guys great message to send across to the kids, and how is killing a criminal for a crime he/she commited making them pay death is an easy way out, a cowards way out they should be made to suffer yes but death isn't suffering it's over in seconds, prison, solitary, no freedom etc should be used as a punishment
In killing someone no matter what they've done your bringing yourself down to their level and that makes you the murderer too so shouldn't you find yourself on death row too
Even murderers who have taking a life themselves why is punishing them with the same fate they gave their victim the right thing to do it's playing into their hands because how do they get to suffer a lethal injection is over in seconds there is NO suffering for them
Behemoth
22-01-2006, 18:07
If DNA testing is done correctly then it isn't possible for it to be wrong. There is about a 1 in a billion chance of two people's DNA fingerprints being exactly the same. The mistakes that occur are always human.
~charlie-lou~
22-01-2006, 23:23
I don't know.... I have a fiery temper and so quite frequently say people deserve to die, but my genuine, thought out opinion is that the death penalty is seriously hypocritical:
"You murdered someone. This is a terrible and disgusting thing to do and is NEVER excusable, and therefore we are going to....
..... kill you back."
:searchme:
To me, that is completely hypocritical and nonsensical.
i don't know if i believe in the death penalty
I do not believe in the death penalty.
I do not want instutionalised murder in my name.
That said, I think that a reform of the prison system in this country is long overdue. I think that hard labour should be introduced, a few orange clad chain gangs working on picking up litter and fixing roads in the lovely scottish weather should be a deterent.
Prisons should offer training and reform anyone who can be reformed, but life should mean life for murder, child rape etc. And these people should be made to repay their debt to society through hard, unpaid, work - while keeping society safe from them.
LUSHLOOKE69
29-01-2006, 15:51
I can see all points of view on this subject. Personally I 100% believe that the death penalty should be reintroduced! It costs more to keep the prisoner in prison than it would to spend the equivalent time in the ritz. When there is Dna evidence and the person will never be released from prisons these scums should just be wiped out (im thinking about the likes of Myra Hindley) who to me had a pleasent experience in prison including having relaationships. Saying that I do not believe these people should be tortured before being killed as some do i think they jus hav a lethal injection just to get rid of them. To torture them would us just as bad as them.
DaVeyWaVey
12-02-2008, 23:02
I thought this would be an interesting discussion to start. Yesterday, Gary NewLove's killers were sentenced to jail and now the wife of the deceased spoke out yesterday. Article here:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/justice/article790837.ece
So do you think the death penalty should be something introduced to Britain or do you think the right punishment is for them to serve their sentences in jail? (the biggest sentence given to one of the lads was 17 years, which seriously isn't enough)
I think there has already been a thread on this, but it was called, is the death penalty ever justified
DaVeyWaVey
12-02-2008, 23:06
Whoops! Teach me to forget going through the search facility. Feel free to merge this to the other thread mods, wherever it is.
Behemoth
12-02-2008, 23:08
Whoops! Teach me to forget going through the search facility. Feel free to merge this to the other thread mods, wherever it is.
Merged... :)
Looks like its been merged :)
I think its a really hard topic, but at the same time you dont want to sink to there level do you?
DaVeyWaVey
12-02-2008, 23:12
That's what I was thinking Abbie. Though I can understand why the wife is saying these things, she is extremely upset, can't imagine what she's going through and I would probably say the same things if a loved one of mine died.
I just don't think the sentences they got were enough - why can't life mean life? They should never be released, but in 17 years, all of them will be released on the streets again or less than that if they behave well inside. :rolleyes:
She said soemthing about once that offense has been committed they have no human rights-on the news that I watched. Well if you kill then, then you in turn have comitted murder, so does that not mean you shouldnt have your human rights either?
Chloe O'brien
12-02-2008, 23:29
Everyone in the country can understand Gery's wife for wanting the death penlty bought back, but I still stand by my opinion that it would just make whoever the exicutioner no better that those scumbags who murdered that poor man. The British Criminal Justice need to realise that when criminals are sentenced for a crime then they should serve the maximum term in a 5 by 4 room with a bucket to wee in. It is no wonder that families of victims are outraged at the way criminals are treated with there claims that their human rights have been violated while serving time in prison. Once they have committed a crime and been sentence they should loose all rights to be treated as a fellow human being and locked away.
The problem with an eye for an eye is that the world ends up blind.
I agree with the death penatly for some crimes such as paedophillia. I don't think it should be used for murder or manslaughter though.
I'm not sure about terrorism. In one sense they deserve to die for killing innocent people and there is always the chance that they could plot another terrorist activity. However, they did kill people in the name of religion, it will just make martys of them to execute them.
There is a case going on in America for six people involved in the 9/11 attacks. The prosecution is pushing for the death penalty which is ultimately the judge's decision. In this case I would agree and say that the death penalty is justified.
I guess it all comes down to the seriousness of the crime and how it affected the persons involved and their relatives. It would have to be judged on an individual case.
Did anyone watch Horizon a couple of weeks ago, the episode was called How To Kill A Human?
StarsOfCCTV
12-02-2008, 23:40
The death penalty is never justified. Let a person rot in jail for the rest of their life (sorry if I sound harsh) The problem with the justice system in Britain is Life does not mean life! In America it does - Anyone see Louis Theroux behind bars?
Also, there have been miscarriges of justice in the past where people have been proved innocent after being killed.
A government who allows the death penalty is no better than the murderer/peadophile (sp?) etc who did the crime in the first place.
I agree with the death penatly for some crimes such as paedophillia. I don't think it should be used for murder or manslaughter though.
I think that is were we differ... I don't agree with Death penalty, doesn't make anyone think about what they have done.. it is over, your dead, what have you learnt??? nothing. At least sitting in jail you have time to reflect on your crime but I do think prison sentences are way to low.. 6 - 7 years for rape or paedophillia?? that is just wrong, the victims have to live with it for the rest of their lives, why can't the monsters who did this to them suffer the same?
I don't think prison is the answer either.. I think part prison with punishment (like they do in some eastern countries, choping hand off if you steal, chop your bits of if you rape) you can't continue with you sick perversion and you suffer for the rest of your life like your victim has
senorita
13-02-2008, 11:29
Siobhan I agree with you, losing a hand for stealing, etc is a good and permanant reminder of why they have lost theor hand etc.
Prison sentences need looking at, life should mean life as why is it called life if it can be governed in terms of years to be served?
I have spoken to a couple of prison wardens and they were very honest and open about the system - peodo's have a nice bed, pictures on the walls and their own garden as they have to be kept segregated from other prisoners - but they can chat to like minded people - so would any counselling they recieve really work?
I heard of a guy who lost his job, but stole some food to feed his family - he was desparate - he got 3 years as the judge wanted to make an example of him!
I used to be really pro death penalty, now I think life should mean life, prison life should be tough, I believe in chain gangs where they work the land, pick up litter etc - and I believe that some people can have their lives turned around, if they want it to be.
This has been a really interesting thread to read, and everyone has been great about expressing their viewpoints and not getting hett up over peoples differing views. For some crimes I think I could push the lever for the electric chair, but there again as people rightfully say that makes me as bad as the criminal - some crimes just make me feel sick, and to think that the criminals could get away with serving a few years for committing it in this country also makes me sick.
Chloe O'brien
13-02-2008, 12:30
If the death penalty was to be brought back in who would make the decision on what is justified as having to be sent to death, would if be for murders if so who it be for all who comitted murder?
Say to have a scenario where you have 2 young men in there 20's. One young man goes out with his friends on a night out and get's drunk. They come out of a club and can't get a taxi so one man takes the decision to drive his friends home despite being drunk. There is an accident and people die because of this man drink driving. He has committed murder!!
Another young man in his 20's is a drug addict looking for money to feed his habit. He mugs and old lady. The old lady suffers injuries and dies from them. Again this young man has committed murder!! who do you exacute because they both have committed a crime of murder.
This is why bringing back the death penalty is worng because it can't be justified would any judge in the country sentance a woman who killed her abusive husband? No
We need proper sentances and punishments for the appropraite crimes. Sex offenders should be castrated or be chemically injected so that they won't be able to have sex ever again, or even having PERV tattooed on their forehead.
If the death penalty was to be brought back in who would make the decision on what is justified as having to be sent to death, would if be for murders if so who it be for all who comitted murder?
Say to have a scenario where you have 2 young men in there 20's. One young man goes out with his friends on a night out and get's drunk. They come out of a club and can't get a taxi so one man takes the decision to drive his friends home despite being drunk. There is an accident and people die because of this man drink driving. He has committed murder!!
Another young man in his 20's is a drug addict looking for money to feed his habit. He mugs and old lady. The old lady suffers injuries and dies from them. Again this young man has committed murder!! who do you exacute because they both have committed a crime of murder.
This is why bringing back the death penalty is worng because it can't be justified would any judge in the country sentance a woman who killed her abusive husband? No
We need proper sentances and punishments for the appropraite crimes. Sex offenders should be castrated or be chemically injected so that they won't be able to have sex ever again, or even having PERV tattooed on their forehead.
I agree Kath with everything you said.
In our modern day soceity we are SO complicated and there are always several factors in a crime which is why a death penalty can be never justified.
Wht about those who are mentally ill but commit murder?
The solution to our problem isnt bringing back old methods, or even stciking to the system now. It needs to be changed so its fair and the sentence you get is what you WILL serve.
Its ok - news down here at the moment is that a cul de sac in Cornwall is having to fight to stop offenders being housed in a property on their estate instead of in jail because of overcrowding.
One of the solicitors in the Gary Newlove case is appealing against the 17yr sentence imposed, saying its over the maximum that has been specified by the Ministry of Justice or someone, so he could now also have his sentence reduced.
Our justice system is completely t*ts up as far as I'm concerned. The conditions in jails are too cosy and most offenders come out, to reoffend just so they can go back in again. They have more given to them on a plate than some people work for a lifetime to achieve - its all wrong.
Another problem we have now though, is the human rights organisations. Sorry, but they keep campaigning saying hows this and that contravenes that persons human rights - if they have murdered someone - why should they have any human rights whatsoever!!!
Another problem we have now though, is the human rights organisations. Sorry, but they keep campaigning saying hows this and that contravenes that persons human rights - if they have murdered someone - why should they have any human rights whatsoever!!!
Well said.. what rights did the person who was murdered have??? they can't say "sorry but you are in voliation of Human rights code 123 so you can't kill me".. What rights do the relatives of the deceased have?
Jail shouldn't be a luxury or be paid for by our taxes.. it should be a punishment, is that what the judge is suppose to do.. hand out punishment. I don't call jail punishment for a lot of people.
Another problem we have now though, is the human rights organisations. Sorry, but they keep campaigning saying hows this and that contravenes that persons human rights - if they have murdered someone - why should they have any human rights whatsoever!!!
Well said.. what rights did the person who was murdered have??? they can't say "sorry but you are in voliation of Human rights code 123 so you can't kill me".. What rights do the relatives of the deceased have?
Jail shouldn't be a luxury or be paid for by our taxes.. it should be a punishment, is that what the judge is suppose to do.. hand out punishment. I don't call jail punishment for a lot of people.
I totally agree, they should have human rights, but not to the full extent that they themselves are killed
DaVeyWaVey
13-02-2008, 15:49
Another problem we have now though, is the human rights organisations. Sorry, but they keep campaigning saying hows this and that contravenes that persons human rights - if they have murdered someone - why should they have any human rights whatsoever!!!
It's disgusting that he wants to appeal. None of the killers deserve human rights. They lost theirs as soon as they killed Gary Newlove and robbed him of his human rights.
pookie1968uk
13-02-2008, 18:22
i would love to say i think the death penalty should return but really i know that it wouldnt make things any better.
instead they need to make life sentences life in jail and stop jail being like a holiday camp with sky tv etc. lets at least make a jail term like a real punishment. i cant see this happening though as there are too many pc people fighting to human rights etc to the extreme these days, the same people who dont encourage discipline of children in any form.
Pinkbanana
13-02-2008, 18:37
I think the number of miscarriages of justice over the years, is enough for me to oppose the death penalty.
I think that prisons should become places of real hardship (more on the lines of American jails), and not holiday inns like they seem to be at present.
Edit: Oh and a LIFE sentence to mean a LIFE sentence........NO APPEAL!!!!
I think the number of miscarriages of justice over the years, is enough for me to oppose the death penalty.
I think that prisons should become places of real hardship (more on the lines of American jails), and not holiday inns like they seem to be at present.
Edit: Oh and a LIFE sentence to mean a LIFE sentence........NO APPEAL!!!!
I totally agree, they should live on bread and water, not be allowed to mix to either brag about their crimes or get taught more and should serve all of their sentence, no early release because they were good.
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