Dean Wicks

[xx_Dan_xx]

I am sorry but this really does not cut it with me .... he should go to prison, get on the sex offenders register and only supervised visits with his daughter :angry:

Soaps supposedly shows experiences and provide help across in these storyline situations... What about victims that don't get that justice, where the perpetrator gets off... Can't just forget about them and ignore any help these soaps could give in a situation where the rapist doesn't go to prison just because viewers want him in prison. Dean may of not been punished they way we want but this storyline has proven to show how regardless Dean's state, the victim was shown the support from their family and got their life back on track. Not often this scenarios are shown and I applaud EE going this way and not just going down the route where the rapist is jailed which, I assume, doesn't happen as often as we like.

[xx_Dan_xx]

.

[parkerman]

I'm sure it's right that many rapists don't go to prison but I'm not sure how the way this story is going helps women who have been raped. As we know millions watch EE and they are being given a message of despair for the victim. What's the point in reporting the rape if the perpetrator is going to get away with it? It needs to give some hope that rapists are caught and sentenced otherwise it's a rapist's charter to carry on regardless as they won't have to go to prison. Even if the statistics do show that many rapists get away with it, EE has no business encouraging this idea.

Even worse is the idea that Dean might get his comeuppance by being physically attacked by Mick. That's a great lesson to teach. Take the law into your own hands - I don't think so.

[tammyy2j]

Why did Dominic make Dean a rapist if his plan for Dean was the child with Shabham all along?


Di Angelo said: "At the end of the day it's a soap, so we have to finish the story and not leave it unresolved in any way. I'm not saying he should go to prison, though - I don't think he should, because the real-life statistics don't reflect that.

"The vast majority of these people don't face judicial punishment, and that's one thing EastEnders really wanted to get across. That's what makes it so good - everyone feels that sense of injustice.

"But there are other ways for Dean to be punished, like getting physically abused by Mick, or having his financial or personal life attacked. He's constantly being faced with that - viewers will see him being punished on a daily basis."

Billy suffers more than Dean all the time and he isn't a rapist

[xx_Dan_xx]

I'm sure it's right that many rapists don't go to prison but I'm not sure how the way this story is going helps women who have been raped. As we know millions watch EE and they are being given a message of despair for the victim. What's the point in reporting the rape if the perpetrator is going to get away with it? It needs to give some hope that rapists are caught and sentenced otherwise it's a rapist's charter to carry on regardless as they won't have to go to prison. Even if the statistics do show that many rapists get away with it, EE has no business encouraging this idea.

Even worse is the idea that Dean might get his comeuppance by being physically attacked by Mick. That's a great lesson to teach. Take the law into your own hands - I don't think so.

This storyline showed us Linda is/was able to get her life back on track, give her a sense of safety in her own home - what kind of help are you looking for? I agree that victims should be confident in reporting the crime and should feel they can get justice but that's not always the case. Showing conviction on a soap doesn't change how the law works so why continuously show one experience in a rape situation. EE has the business to provide information in many situations for many different crimes - helping the victim is as important as catching the perpetrator. What about all the victims out there who haven't got justice, victims whose lives are in tatters because they don't know how or where to get help or what to do if their perpetrator is still on the streets.

Of course I'd rather see Dean in jail to rot but if all EE gave to rape victims was to report to the police, he gets caught - that's it done. It doesn't reflect some real life scenarios where the person gets out. Then what? EE or any soaps never show what happens then, or show the type of help they can still receive, or to know you can take control of your life back and to know your family will support you.

Do those victims not deserve help/information from soaps who provide this information to those out there as to satisfied the average viewer or to provide information for victims whose scenario occurs so little.

Maybe I have a less popular opinion here but I am thinking about all the victims and not just a few. Soaps have done the ideal situation for rapes in the past where they were arrested - show us new scenarios so we can know how to help someone in that situation rather than repeat situations we've seen. Like you said, most rapists get away, disgusting though that it is, we need to know rather than pretend it doesn't happen or avoid it. The focus is on the victim not the perpetrator.

[xx_Dan_xx]

.

[tammyy2j]

How can Linda move on and be safe with Dean living in such close proximity to her and her family and also he is Mick's brother

[maidmarian]

How can Linda move on and be safe with Dean living in such close proximity to her and her family and also he is Mick's brother

Yes -I agree Tammy-. Linda is quite a strong
character and was/is an enduring lovable
relationship. All her " family" did not support her!
and being able to live day to day is not
really the same as fully getting over something.

There may be cases where what Dan propounds
can happen.But Linda isnt one of them.

Dean is constantly around ( also his dreadful
mother).He is now staying longer and contract
extended which is longer for Linda to.endure his
proximity.

I'm sure the Jade story is an attempt to show
him.in a better light. Has as been pointed
out in another post if he was a convicted Sex
Offender he would not be allowed access to.children!


The BBC is a publicly funded body . They can't
change what happens in rape cases but they
shouldnt be re-inforcing " the rape doesn't
really count " mentality of characters like
Dean and his followers.

[maidmarian]

Dupl

[tammyy2j]

Linda the victim has been lost in shuffle now of Dean's storyline with Jade/Roya, the rape was an down played also for Stan's death and funeral and Mick's discovery that Shirley is his real mother

Linda needs Dean to admit what he done and also the Carter family need to apologise to her and I think only Mick and her kids believe Linda

I don't think anyone on the Square but Stacey believes Dean raped her

[xx_Dan_xx]

How can Linda move on and be safe with Dean living in such close proximity to her and her family and also he is Mick's brother

True but I've read a lot of news articles where the rapist was a family member - if they get away with it - isn't it good to receive help and information about what you can do and what is available to you?

Aren't storylines these soaps do suppose to help raise awareness and provide information to all kinds of victims in all scenarios of crimes.

Why shouldn't soaps provide information and help to people who tried to get legal justice and couldn't.

I get why you want Dean jailed to be shown badly - to encourage victims to come forward and to feel that justice can be served and that showing it doesn't wouldn't help. I understand. But what do you have in mind when situations like that don't happen... It is important to encourage victims to seek justice but what then if the victim doesn't get justice? Do you just end the help there or avoid covering more realistic scenarios? Soaps have a duty when covering these crimes to provide help to everyone in all situations - to try make a difference and help everyone.

I'd imagine if a rape victim saw this ideal situation - so then decided to go to the police but only to find its too late, that they left it too long. What happens to these people? In John-Paul's case on Hollyoaks - he was told if had a bath/shower they'd have no evidence - meaning if the victim waited just even a day after the event - it isn't looking good? So for a victim at home watching this - it might be too late for DNA evidence angle. What happens to them? EE need to show the type of help they can get, professional help was shown very little in EE which is a mark down from me, but what was shown that Linda has the support of those closet to her, and we can all agree Linda is on her way to who she was before.

Please reply to this post with this question answered, if Dean was arrested immediately, where is the help for the other victims?

[xx_Dan_xx]

.

[Dazzle]

Maybe I have a less popular opinion here but I am thinking about all the victims and not just a few. Soaps have done the ideal situation for rapes in the past where they were arrested - show us new scenarios so we can know how to help someone in that situation rather than repeat situations we've seen. Like you said, most rapists get away, disgusting though that it is, we need to know rather than pretend it doesn't happen or avoid it. The focus is on the victim not the perpetrator.

I understand the point you're making and there is something to be said with showing that rape victims can get on with their lives even without justice

HOWEVER what Matt di Angelo and DTC appear not to understand is that most viewers do not want to watch the rapist getting on with his life. Let him leave Albert Square so that happens off screen.

Bit in bold: that isn't how the storyline has played out though. Most of it's been about the Carter feud, Shirley's dilemma and Dean's self-pity. There's been very little focus on how Linda's coping since the reveal - which is pretty outrageous. Also, she's surrounded by a community who have no idea if she was lying or not about the rape. No doubt many of them think she was (as evidenced by Ian's remark a few weeks ago).

It's obvious that Matt is DTC's favourite and that's coming across on screen. We don't want to see rapists written that way! If he wasn't being written so sympathetically there wouldn't be such an outcry about this.

Matt di Angelo obviously has no idea how being raped profoundly affects victims, sometimes for the rest of their lives, if he thinks minor punishments "on a daily basis" will satisfy viewers.


Billy suffers more than Dean all the time and he isn't a rapist

Very good point.


The BBC is a publicly funded body . They can't
change what happens in rape cases but they
shouldnt be re-inforcing " the rape doesn't
really count " mentality of characters like
Dean and his followers.

Another excellent point. By changing their mind about Dean's comeuppance DTC and his team have effectively downplayed the seriousness of rape as Dean's allowed to get on with his life and bond with his daughter.

Dan - how exactly has this storyline given help and information to victims who don't get justice? All that's been shown is that Linda's ordeal at the police interview was pointless and that, at the very best, most of the community think it's possible she lied about rape to cover up her adultery. Yes her close family believe her but that's true of most rape victims (though obviously not all).

I'm very close to someone who was raped in a similar way to Linda was, by a "friend", less than two years ago (and he wasn't even charged let alone convicted, though the police believed her). I assure you this storyline has been of no help to her. EE used to be her favourite TV program but why should she and other victims suffer seeing someone similar to their attacker getting on with their life and, worse, being written about sympathetically? It's quite outrageous!!! :angry:

[maidmarian]

True but I've read a lot of news articles where the rapist was a family member - if they get away with it - isn't it good to receive help and information about what you can do and what is available to you?

Aren't storylines these soaps do suppose to help raise awareness and provide information to all kinds of victims in all scenarios of crimes.

Why shouldn't soaps provide information and help to people who tried to get legal justice and couldn't.



I get why you want Dean jailed to be shown badly - to encourage victims to come forward and to feel that justice can be served and that showing it doesn't wouldn't help. I understand. But what do you have in mind when situations like that don't happen... It is important to encourage victims to seek justice but what then if the victim doesn't get justice? Do you just end the help there or avoid covering more realistic scenarios? Soaps have a duty when covering these crimes to provide help to everyone in all situations - to try make a difference and help everyone.

I'd imagine if a rape victim saw this ideal situation - so then decided to go to the police but only to find its too late, that they left it too long. What happens to these people? In John-Paul's case on Hollyoaks - he was told if had a bath/shower they'd have no evidence - meaning if the victim waited just even a day after the event - it isn't looking good? So for a victim at home watching this - it might be too late for DNA evidence angle. What happens to them? EE need to show the type of help they can get, professional help was shown very little in EE which is a mark down from me, but what was shown that Linda has the support of those closet to her, and we can all agree Linda is on her way to who she was before.

Please reply to this post with this question answered, if Dean was arrested immediately, where is the help for the other victims?

Well.Dean not being arrested immediately hasn't
provided help for victims either.You do.say that
EE didnt give much info- so thats not a dig.I do
accept you are trying to put a positive slant
on a dreadful.crime & its effects.

I.agree victims do need help.& info. There have been
countless examples on tv of people being made aware about
not bathing/showering after a rape - going back several
years.But it does need repeating together with info
about where other help is available. Even if rapist is
jailed there are many mental.& physical health
problems that can continue for the victim.

EE has been more concerned about Dean than
Linda throughout and I think that brings some
professional judgements into question.
You cant get valid info over to the public/victims
when the main agenda is rehabiliating the rapist

Info.could have been given in the early stages
even before a decision about arrest was made.
I dont believe that most residents of the Square
would have behaved as they did if the story had been
written a year or two.earlier.

The story when first mooted was generally
received postively as an opportunity to.encourage
Victims to come forward . In view of the many
well-published "historical " cases.

I dont think at that stage it was expected that
automatic arrest & conviction would follow
shortly. There would have been ample
time to give info & help.
Disillusion set in - when the story went on&
on without resolution and with too much favourable
attention to.the rapist.

We were promised justice but not the legal kind
But so far none of any kind. And now another
story spotlighting the rapist.
You comment that it is part of soaps remit
raise awareness and I would agree generally.
But Im afraid that usually they concentrate
on the info that suits their storyline rather
whole picture which can lead to misinformation
& foster prejudice.

So a good oppotunity wasted or misused.!!

[maidmarian]

True but I've read a lot of news articles where the rapist was a family member - if they get away with it - isn't it good to receive help and information about what you can do and what is available to you?

Aren't storylines these soaps do suppose to help raise awareness and provide information to all kinds of victims in all scenarios of crimes.

Why shouldn't soaps provide information and help to people who tried to get legal justice and couldn't.



I get why you want Dean jailed to be shown badly - to encourage victims to come forward and to feel that justice can be served and that showing it doesn't wouldn't help. I understand. But what do you have in mind when situations like that don't happen... It is important to encourage victims to seek justice but what then if the victim doesn't get justice? Do you just end the help there or avoid covering more realistic scenarios? Soaps have a duty when covering these crimes to provide help to everyone in all situations - to try make a difference and help everyone.

I'd imagine if a rape victim saw this ideal situation - so then decided to go to the police but only to find its too late, that they left it too long. What happens to these people? In John-Paul's case on Hollyoaks - he was told if had a bath/shower they'd have no evidence - meaning if the victim waited just even a day after the event - it isn't looking good? So for a victim at home watching this - it might be too late for DNA evidence angle. What happens to them? EE need to show the type of help they can get, professional help was shown very little in EE which is a mark down from me, but what was shown that Linda has the support of those closet to her, and we can all agree Linda is on her way to who she was before.

Please reply to this post with this question answered, if Dean was arrested immediately, where is the help for the other victims?

Well.Dean not being arrested immediately hasn't
provided help for victims either.You do.say that
EE didnt give much info- so thats not a dig.I do
accept you are trying to put a positive slant
on a dreadful.crime & its effects.

I.agree victims do need help.& info. There have been
countless examples on tv of people being made aware about
not bathing/showering after a rape - going back several
years.But it does need repeating together with info
about where other help is available. Even if rapist is
jailed there are many mental.& physical health
problems that can continue for the victim.

EE has been more concerned about Dean than
Linda throughout and I think that brings some
professional judgements into question.
You cant get valid info over to the public/victims
when the main agenda is rehabiliating the rapist

Info.could have been given in the early stages
even before a decision about arrest was made.
I dont believe that most residents of the Square
would have behaved as they did if the story had been
written a year or two.earlier.

The story when first mooted was generally
received postively as an opportunity to.encourage
Victims to come forward . In view of the many
well-published "historical " cases.

I dont think at that stage it was expected that
automatic arrest & conviction would follow
shortly. There would have been ample
time to give info & help.
Disillusion set in - when the story went on&
on without resolution and with too much favourable
attention to.the rapist.

We were promised justice but not the legal kind
But so far none of any kind. And now another
story spotlighting the rapist.
You comment that it is part of soaps remit
raise awareness and I would agree generally.
But Im afraid that usually they concentrate
on the info that suits their storyline rather
whole picture which can lead to misinformation
& foster prejudice.

So a good oppotunity wasted or misused.!!

[lizann]

sure whats a bit of rape between families, that is the attitude im getting from dtc and matt

where has dean suffered exactly, he has his business, his family and now a kid

linda is the one suffering

[parkerman]

I can feel a letter to the Radio Times coming on......

[lizann]

dean really being punished bed hopping with roxy

[tammyy2j]

dean really being punished bed hopping with roxy

I was going to suggest he spiked her drink but she was drinking a far amount and in bed she seemed really into him pardon the pun :p

[Perdita]

...

[Perdita]

I was going to suggest he spiked her drink but she was drinking a far amount and in bed she seemed really into him pardon the pun :p
:eek:

[Kim]

I suppose the fact that his child has CF is supposed to be seen as a punishment (as he'll be going back through what he already did with his brother) but it doesn't wash with me. I stopped watching a while ago but read a few comments online so that I'm not completely out of the loop if I ever decide to start watching again.

I like the Masoods and was really looking forward to them getting some screentime, I'm so annoyed that the Carters had to be involved. It'll probably be more about Shirley and the rapist than it will about Masood and Shabnam.

Roxy and Dean :eek: I know nothing's been proven but given that her sister is a victim of rape, shouldn't she run in the opposite direction to anyone accused of rape?

[tammyy2j]

No one on the Square but Stacey believes Dean raped Linda

[parkerman]

No one on the Square but Stacey believes Dean raped Linda
Yes, and that's part of the problem. At the moment most on the Square don't know, don't care or believe Linda is lying. It's all a long way from Dean "paying" for his horrible crime.

[Dazzle]

The news that Dean's sticking around the square for the foreseeable future, and the way he's been written recently, have reluctantly led me to the conclusion that Storyseeker1 was right that Dean's supposed to be in denial about the rape (we recently had a lengthy debate about this on another thread).

I stand by my assertion that the rape, the bullying and intimidation are the actions of someone without empathy or remorse, but it seems apparent the writers have changed their minds and that Dean's now supposed to be a nice guy who did a bad thing! :sick:

I'll never accept that or forgive him, no matter how much suffering they pile on him. Some of his supporters assert he's mentally ill and needs help but I won't accept that excuse either. He's troubled (but then so are most of the residents of Albert Square) but not to the extent that he's mentally ill and not capable of being responsible for his actions. He needs to go to prison not to a psychiatric hospital! :angry:


I suppose the fact that his child has CF is supposed to be seen as a punishment (as he'll be going back through what he already did with his brother) but it doesn't wash with me.

Lots of people are being punished, including poor Jade herself, so it doesn't wash with me either. Also, if the writers are hoping his love for his daughter will erase the rape in the viewers' minds, they're going to be disappointed.


No one on the Square but Stacey believes Dean raped Linda

Sharon believes Linda and I think Jane does too. Masood called him a rapist but doesn't seem to care about it - certainly not enough to keep his granddaughter away from him.

This is one of the major problems of the writers trying whitewash the rape. Linda is still suffering because her reputation's been ruined. It must be awful to live with people whispering that you accused someone of rape just to hide your adultery. Dean's actions must become common knowledge to alleviate Linda's situation.

There's also the fact that Dean is, and always will be, a danger to women. :angry:

[maidmarian]

The news that Dean's sticking around the square for the foreseeable future, and the way he's been written recently, have reluctantly led me to the conclusion that Storyseeker1 was right that Dean's supposed to be in denial about the rape (we recently had a lengthy debate about this on another thread).

I stand by my assertion that the rape, the bullying and intimidation are the actions of someone without empathy or remorse, but it seems apparent the writers have changed their minds and that Dean's now supposed to be a nice guy who did a bad thing! :sick:

I'll never accept that or forgive him, no matter how much suffering they pile on him. Some of his supporters assert he's mentally ill and needs help but I won't accept that excuse either. He's troubled (but then so are most of the residents of Albert Square) but not to the extent that he's mentally ill and not capable of being responsible for his actions. He needs to go to prison not to a psychiatric hospital! :angry:



Lots of people are being punished, including poor Jade herself, so it doesn't wash with me either. Also, if the writers are hoping his love for his daughter will erase the rape in the viewers' minds, they're going to be disappointed.



Sharon believes Linda and I think Jane does too. Masood called him a rapist but doesn't seem to care about it - certainly not enough to keep his granddaughter away from him.

This is one of the major problems of the writers trying whitewash the rape. Linda is still suffering because her reputation's been ruined. It must be awful to live with people whispering that you accused someone of rape just to hide your adultery. Dean's actions must become common knowledge to alleviate Linda's situation.

There's also the fact that Dean is, and always will be, a danger to women. :angry:

I think this storyline has been dealt with very
irresponsibly.
They should have decided what Deans condition/
mindset.was and written it consistently with
qualified advice.The actor should have been
advised how to play the role to reflect the type
of mental state/ personality intended.

The way things are progressing nothing is
making sense which is dangerous when
portraying serious personality disorders/
?illnesses that have led to a serious crime
- rape!!

It leads to misinformation and I although
I believe "Soaps" can inform the public
It needs to be done accurately not
trivialised for dramatic effect and sensationalism.

They need to do something to recify Lindas
situation regarding.how she is perceived by
neighbours etc. Its certainly no encouragement
to any woman to report rape.

And as point already made- whatever has
caused Deans actions - he is dangerous-
not likely to be an isolated incident and
others need to be protected .
Its certainly not appropriate or commensurate
punishment to give an innocent child an
illness as supposed retribution for a rapist.

I think both yourself and storyseeker put
forward good arguments for opinions.
But even a fully qualified expert can't
diagnose correctly when info given changes
constantly.

It was a good idea for a storyline that's
been ruined by inconsistent planning/
writing/ acting and more than a touch of
self-importance!!

[maidmarian]

Dupl

[tammyy2j]

There is no way to redeem Dean, he is a rapist :angry:

[parkerman]

Given all the bad publicity the BBC has received over the last couple of years, Jimmy Savile, Rolf Harris etc., you'd think they might be a bit more sensitive to such issues instead of appearing to brush Dean's rape of Linda aside. Perhaps they haven't changed at all since the 70s and 80s.

[maidmarian]

Given all the bad publicity the BBC has received over the last couple of years, Jimmy Savile, Rolf Harris etc., you'd think they might be a bit more sensitive to such issues instead of appearing to brush Dean's rape of Linda aside. Perhaps they haven't changed at all since the 70s and 80s.

Old Proverb ??
The fish rots from.the head down!!

[maidmarian]

Dupl

[Dazzle]

The DS interview with Matt di Angelo which has got us all talking is apparently taken from a longer interview with him in Inside Soap. I've seen it said on social media (though I can't confirm this) that in the extended interview Matt says Dean will still get his planned comeuppance - but it's been delayed for the time being.

If this is true I can't say it makes me feel much better, as what's to stop DTC from keeping extending Matt's contract forever? After all, we didn't expect it to go on as long as it already has. In the meantime we're forced to watch Dean get on with normal life - and he's a major character with a lot of screen time - with no guarantee we'll get a satisfactory outcome at the end of it.


Given all the bad publicity the BBC has received over the last couple of years, Jimmy Savile, Rolf Harris etc., you'd think they might be a bit more sensitive to such issues instead of appearing to brush Dean's rape of Linda aside. Perhaps they haven't changed at all since the 70s and 80s.

Maybe all the outrage will force DTC's bosses at the BBC to take action? We can only hope... :searchme:

[parkerman]

Maybe all the outrage will force DTC's bosses at the BBC to take action? We can only hope... :searchme:
Do they know there is outrage amongst viewers? Where is it expressed?

[Dazzle]

Do they know there is outrage amongst viewers? Where is it expressed?

On Facebook, Twitter and other soap forums. The majority of opinions voiced agree with us, so there's no way DTC and his team are unaware of the disquiet at Dean's continuing presence. Whether they care is the question.

[maidmarian]

On Facebook, Twitter and other soap forums. The majority of opinions voiced agree with us, so there's no way DTC and his team are unaware of the disquiet at Dean's continuing presence. Whether they care is the question.

I think the only thing that will concentrate
their minds is if viewing figures start to
noticably slip.I had been wondering if you
or another forum.member knew if figures
for say last few weeks were on average
less than previous few months.
Can find figures for odd episodes but not
trends.
Thanks -in advance-if anyone has any info.

I did also.wonder if people who complain
on.Twitter etc would also complain to BBC
direct or to Ofcom-I think - may be wrong
that BBC would only take note of official
complaints ?!

[maidmarian]

Dupl

[Dazzle]

According to BARB ratings for the week ending 7th June 2015, EE's Monday episode out-performed both of Corrie's Monday episodes - which is unusual I believe. Eastenders usually appears several times in the top 5 most watch programmes so there's been no radical slipping of ratings so far. I'm guessing most long-term viewers won't feel strongly enough to give up their fix altogether (myself included http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-ashamed001.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)) even if they're disgusted at the Dean situation.

http://www.barb.co.uk/

As for complaints - who knows - but anyone with any vested interest in EE at the moment must be aware that lots of viewers aren't happy. :wall:

[lizann]

so just as he is proven as jade's real dad, he thinks he can just get her, him and shirley cant take her

[Perdita]

Somehow I think she will be on Albert Square before you know it!

[storyseeker1]

Not after watching tonight's ep. What a big baby dean is!

[parkerman]

Not long now till Dean's "comeuppance". I reckon another 10 or 20 years should do it....

[Dazzle]

Not long now till Dean's \"comeuppance\". I reckon another 10 or 20 years should do it....

Phew! Not long to wait then... http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/confused/smileys-confused-140297.gif (http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/)

[Kim]

Dean will go out at the same time as DTC I reckon. On average that'll be in a year and a half. Hope someone comes to their senses re: both.

[storyseeker1]

Supposed to be this xmas special. After all, what's an Eastenders xmas special without a tragedy? I'm guessing that after months of custody battles and talks, Dean will finally have his daughter Jade come home with him, and by this time he will also have developed a fatherly love for her, only for her to die just as soon as she's home.

[parkerman]

So a tragedy for Dean and his comeuppance.....oh, hang on a moment, why are Shabnam, Shirley, Buster, Masood , her foster father and sister and Jade herself all due a comeuppance? What did they all do?

[Dazzle]

So a tragedy for Dean and his comeuppance.....oh, hang on a moment, why are Shabnam, Shirley, Buster, Masood , her foster father and sister and Jade herself all due a comeuppance? What did they all do?

To be honest I wouldn't include Shirley in that list. Although I understand her belief in Dean (even though the writers seem to want us to forget she had her doubts at one stage), her harassment of Linda and Mick has been inexcusable. She needs a comeuppance of her own in my opinion (though obviously I don't think it should be Jade's death).

[maidmarian]

To be honest I wouldn't include Shirley in that list. Although I understand her belief in Dean (even though the writers seem to want us to forget she had her doubts at one stage), her harassment of Linda and Mick has been inexcusable. She needs a comeuppance of her own in my opinion (though obviously I don't think it should be Jade's death).

Thanks for putting Shirley in a seperate category.!

Ive never liked her-so thought it was just me.

To me she has behaved very badly to Linda
and Mick but to several others before them.
I dont think.you can ignore persistent
nastiness & cruelty - and in.real life people
dont forget such actions.

[maidmarian]

To be honest I wouldn't include Shirley in that list. Although I understand her belief in Dean (even though the writers seem to want us to forget she had her doubts at one stage), her harassment of Linda and Mick has been inexcusable. She needs a comeuppance of her own in my opinion (though obviously I don't think it should be Jade's death).

Thanks for putting Shirley in a seperate category.!

Ive never liked her-so thought it was just me.

To me she has behaved very badly to Linda
and Mick but to several others before them.
I dont think.you can ignore persistent
nastiness & cruelty - and in.real life people
dont forget such actions.

[Dazzle]

To me she has behaved very badly to Linda
and Mick but to several others before them.
I dont think.you can ignore persistent
nastiness & cruelty - and in.real life people
dont forget such actions.

No, I don't believe for a second Linda and Mick would ever forgive her behaviour in real life, but we know they will - probably sooner rather than later.

[Kim]

I would put Buster in line for a comeuppance too. He knew Shirley was in a relationship with/married to Kevin and yet still slept with her to conceive Dean. At Carly's christening! How trashy.

He seems perfectly happy to pick up as Dad and I don't recall any gratitude towards Kevin for raising his son after Shirley abandoned them, or for always treating him as one of his own.

Dean and Shirley deserve the most by a long way.

[parkerman]

I can understand the feelings about Shirley and Buster but personally I wouldn't put what they've done in the same category as rape.

[Dazzle]

I can understand the felings about Shirley and Buster but personally I wouldn't put what they've done in the same category as rape.

No definitely not. Shirley needs to face the consequences of her actions but in no way is she in the same category as Dean (who I wouldn't be in the least bit sorry to see dead).

As far as Buster goes, everything Kim says above is true but he scored a lot of points with me by persuading Dean he shouldn't be a dad to Jade.

[parkerman]

Agreed, Dazzle.

The point I was really trying to make though is that if Jade dying just as Dean has accepted her is his supposed comeuppance, I will not be happy!!!:angry::angry::angry:

[storyseeker1]

Unfortunately, I fear that will be the best comeuppance we can hope for, unless he grows a conscience and confesses, because there's no other way he can be arrested. The police have said they have no evidence, he's been cleared due to a lack of, and realistically this is sadly what would happen in real life, which is what Eastenders is all about (writing soap drama, but keeping it as realistic as possible).

[parkerman]

Yes, I appreciate that, ss1, but my beef with that as his comeuppance would be the number of other people that would affect as well. It's hardly singling him out for "justice".

[Kim]

Yes, I appreciate that, ss1, but my beef with that as his comeuppance would be the number of other people that would affect as well. It's hardly singling him out for "justice".

I agree.

Also, it feels awfully predictable. The average survival age is into adulthood these days so I would sooner that Dean be disposed of somehow and we see more of the reality for someone living with the condition.

[storyseeker1]

Yes, I understand, too. Unfortunately, like I said, it's probably the best we can hope for as punishment for Dean, sad though it is for everyone else.

[storyseeker1]

I agree.

Also, it feels awfully predictable. The average survival age is into adulthood these days so I would sooner that Dean be disposed of somehow and we see more of the reality for someone living with the condition.

Yes, they say with today's medical expertise, people with CF born in the 21st century can live up to 50. Unfortunately, it only takes one mistake or a bad infection to cause a patient to die from it.

[maidmarian]

Yes, I appreciate that, ss1, but my beef with that as his comeuppance would be the number of other people that would affect as well. It's hardly singling him out for "justice".

there must be some way that even tho he
wont confess and there is no legal justice-
that local people know he is guilty and he is
ostracised to such an extent he has to
move away.

Better than a child being seriously ill and
possibly dying and her family being affected??

Its not true punishment but better than
what seems likely to happen?!

[maidmarian]

dupl

[storyseeker1]

That would be preferable, but I highly doubt it. Eastenders never has a xmas without some big tragedy happening.

[maidmarian]

That would be preferable, but I highly doubt it. Eastenders never has a xmas without some big tragedy happening.

I dont think it likely either ss1-but it shows
how flawed the judgement of those who
make these decisions is!

A tragedy or event portrayed for dramatic effect
(.and ratings) is different to this potential
scenario.

I think its the fact it involves
a child that causes the most concern .
Raising awareness of a serious illness
and portraying it as a form of punishment
are two very different things .
The latter is inexcusable and cruel.

I still have (a very faint) hope that there will
be a rethink.!!

[maidmarian]

dupl

[Dazzle]

While I'm not against some form of karma for Dean (since it seems unlikely we're going to get any other kind of justice), it needs to be directly related to the rape to be a fitting punishment. Like MM says, if he were found out in some way and ostracised from his family and the community (and from Jade's life), I'd accept that because it would be directly down to what he did to Linda. Also, I know I keep saying it, but the community need to be left in no doubt that he's guilty for Linda's sake.

I've seen speculation elsewhere that Ronnie's cameras might come into play in some way since he's seeing Roxy and spending time at her house. The cameras are still there as far as we know so there's a possibility he could be caught on camera either saying or doing something to implicate himself.

[lizann]

ronnie could kill him like she did roxy's other fella carl

[Kim]

ronnie could kill him like she did roxy's other fella carl

I think this could possibly make me start liking Ronnie again...

[Dazzle]

ronnie could kill him like she did roxy's other fella carl

I wouldn't put it past her.


I think this could possibly make me start liking Ronnie again...

I've never stopped liking her but she'd definitely go up even higher in my estimation. :D

[parkerman]

The problem with all these "solutions" to the Dean problem such as Jade dying, Ronnie killing him etc. etc., is that his rape is still not exposed and leaves a doubt that Linda is telling the truth. Any solution MUST include a confession from Dean in one form or another.

[Dazzle]

The problem with all these \"solutions\" to the Dean problem such as Jade dying, Ronnie killing him etc. etc., is that his rape is still not exposed and leaves a doubt that Linda is telling the truth. Any solution MUST include a confession from Dean in one form or another.

I'm hoping Ronnie records him implicating himself on camera and exposes the truth to the community. If she kills him it'll be an added bonus! http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/happy/smileys-happy-514478.gif (http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/)

[parkerman]

Actually I think it would be better if he was exposed as the rapist he is and then had to live with the fact that everyone knows. I'd personally prefer that as a punishment than having him killed off.

[Dazzle]

Actually I think it would be better if he was exposed as the rapist he is and then had to live with the fact that everyone knows. I'd personally prefer that as a punishment than having him killed off.

I do agree to the extent that it's a better punishment for him, especially if Shirley ostracises him. However, for a my personal satisfaction and because he remains a threat to women (and everyone) while at large, I'd be happy to see him killed off in one way or another.

[lizann]

I do agree to the extent that it's a better punishment for him, especially if Shirley ostracises him. However, for a my personal satisfaction and because he remains a threat to women (and everyone) while at large, I'd be happy to see him killed off in one way or another.

would shirley ostracise him i think deep down she knows he could have done it but is in denial plus she don't like linda, buster knows or has doubts too but still wont side with linda, someone else like denise needs to hear a confrontation between dean and linda or ronnie's cameras record him confess and threaten linda and tell all

[lizann]

I do agree to the extent that it's a better punishment for him, especially if Shirley ostracises him. However, for a my personal satisfaction and because he remains a threat to women (and everyone) while at large, I'd be happy to see him killed off in one way or another.

would shirley ostracise him i think deep down she knows he could have done it but is in denial plus she don't like linda, buster knows or has doubts too but still wont side with linda, someone else like denise needs to hear a confrontation between dean and linda or ronnie's cameras record him confess and threaten linda and tell all

[Kim]

Actually I think it would be better if he was exposed as the rapist he is and then had to live with the fact that everyone knows. I'd personally prefer that as a punishment than having him killed off.

I wish DTC would do this if he insists on keeping the character in the show. Characters exposed as rapists have never had to take the flack before (Graham Foster was an isolated guest character who went to prison, Harry Slater returned to Spain before everyone found out what he'd done, and Archie Mitchell was dead before his crimes emerged.) What happened to Wilmott-Brown? Before my time.

[Dazzle]

would shirley ostracise him i think deep down she knows he could have done it but is in denial plus she don't like linda, buster knows or has doubts too but still wont side with linda, someone else like denise needs to hear a confrontation between dean and linda or ronnie's cameras record him confess and threaten linda and tell all

My gut feeling is that Shirley will hate Dean when she knows for sure. At the moment she doesn't want to know but at some point she'll be forced to face the truth. I'm not sure about Buster but he feels strongly enough to try and keep Jade away from Dean - which is a good sign.

[parkerman]

What happened to Wilmott-Brown? Before my time.

Willmott-Brown was tried and found guilty of rape. He served three years and then came back to Walford to ask for Kathy's forgiveness. She refused. I can't quite remember how he finally left but I know Pete wasn't happy about his return! He was later sent to prison again for another rape (off screen) and hasn't been heard from since.

[maidmarian]

Willmott-Brown was tried and found guilty of rape. He served three years and then came back to Walford to ask for Kathy's forgiveness. She refused. I can't quite remember how he finally left but I know Pete wasn't happy about his return! He was later sent to prison again for another rape (off screen) and hasn't been heard from since.

A lot of things happened including threats to
throw him off a bulding and Pete getting a mob
to deal with him. He tried to buy flats from Phil
& Grant and set up a business.
Kept telling Kathy he was sorry but wanting to
restart their special relationship. He signed
a paper to say he would leave Walford but reneged.

Eventually he did make s believable apology and
left Walford. It might have been threat to throw
him off building that changed his mind.
It was a bit jumbled and some repititions to me.

Some time after he left- a character met his
ex-wife and was told he had commited another
rape and was in prison again.Never mentioned
again.

Basically he was in denial right up to the end.

[maidmarian]

Dupl

[tammyy2j]

When Linda discovers Dean is now seeing Roxy she may warn her like she did with Stacey and perhaps Ronnie a victim of rape too can spot the signs from Linda and convince Roxy to dump Dean or Ronnie's secret cameras will catch Dean out

Linda needs to be believed

[Perdita]

EastEnders star Matt Di Angelo doesn't know whether his character will ever be punished for raping Linda Carter.

One of BBC soap's most hard-hitting storylines last year saw Dean rape his sister-in-law Linda (Kellie Bright) in the Vic.

Although Linda bravely decided to report her ordeal, Dean was never charged, and Di Angelo has revealed that it is unlikely he ever will be.

Speaking to What's on TV about whether Dean will get away with the crime, he said: "I think that will happen. I think it is perfectly believable that he got off because there was no evidence, but when you watch a soap, you do want to see the villain lose.

"Although when Dean stands at the bar in the Queen Vic, he could very well be standing next to two murderers, people who are having affairs, others who are burying bodies. There are murderers walking around the Square, but for some reason, it seems worse to have a rapist on the loose.

"I think what makes Dean's rape so shocking is that it was unexpected. People forget that in the same episode, Shirley was walking around with a handgun and ended up putting a couple of caps into Phil Mitchell.

"Put it this way, Dean is now the baddie of the show, so whatever happens from now on, it isn't going to be good."

Di Angelo also discussed his own future on the show, having decided to extend his contact for another 12 months beyond the initial year he signed up for.

"I said I would come back for a year, but I wasn't sure how I would feel after 12 minutes, let alone 12 months," he explained. "I didn't know if I was going to hate it. Or perhaps I wouldn't be able to handle the pace.

"I am enjoying it here at the moment, but there are also other things that I want to do. I am young and there are other roles and shows I would like to do.

"I am not sure what is ahead for me, I am just cracking on, keeping my head down and enjoying the fact that we are doing some good work here."

[maidmarian]

Talented and modest too! Even about
his own violence!!

[maidmarian]

Dupl.

[Dazzle]

Talented and modest too! Even about
his own violence

I've just spent about twenty minutes writing a post venting my disgust at Matt's blasé attitude in the above interview, but I deleted it in frustration. I've said it all before several times and I can't be bothered to repeat it. He really doesn't get what's so problematic about the way this storyline's playing out. He calls Dean the "baddie of the show" but he talks about him almost affectionately - an attitude the whole EE team appear to share. :angry:

[parkerman]

"I think what makes Dean's rape so shocking is that it was unexpected."


So rape would be ok if it was expected then would it?:angry::angry::angry:

[storyseeker1]

I've just spent about twenty minutes writing a post venting my disgust at Matt's blasé attitude in the above interview, but I deleted it in frustration. I've said it all before several times and I can't be bothered to repeat it. He really doesn't get what's so problematic about the way this storyline's playing out. He calls Dean the "baddie of the show" but he talks about him almost affectionately - an attitude the whole EE team appear to share. :angry:

Well, it is his character, who he plays. Actors do tend to get a bit affectionate over their roles because they put their heart and soul into their acting.

[storyseeker1]

So rape would be ok if it was expected then would it?:angry::angry::angry:

I don't think that's quite what he meant. I think he just meant that it was unexpected because it was Dean who did it. I mean, I remember Dean when he first came on EE years ago, and I still cant believe the little mummys-boy would do something so heinous.

[tammyy2j]

I am hoping Ronnie takes him down

I know she likes to control Roxy but she is right about Dean

[Dazzle]

Well, it is his character, who he plays. Actors do tend to get a bit affectionate over their roles because they put their heart and soul into their acting.

Actors often relish playing villains, but that doesn't mean they like their characters or approve of their actions. Now I'm not going so far as to say Matt di Angelo is OK with the rape, but he's certainly displayed no strong feelings against it in the interview we're discussing.

I'm not singling him out because this attitude appears to be endemic amongst the EE team - that's comes through loud and clear in the writing. Matt might be a lovely person and no doubt they all love working with him, but they're letting that get in the way of telling a meaningful and satisfying story. They should be using this platform to explain why rape is such a wicked crime and why the perpetrators deserve severe punishment. A surprising number of people just don't get that, which is why rape stories need handling with kid gloves. :angry:


I don't think that's quite what he meant. I think he just meant that it was unexpected because it was Dean who did it. I mean, I remember Dean when he first came on EE years ago, and I still cant believe the little mummys-boy would do something so heinous.

Firstly, he's wrong that it was unexpected because there was a lot of build up to the rape what with Dean's harassment of Linda and obvious misogynistic attitude.

Secondly, it sounds dangerously like he's trying to justify it by comparing it to Shirley's crime. They are just not comparable because Dean's crime was one of taking control whereas Shirley's was one of losing control. I can't stand Shirley any more either and would be happy to see her banged up, but at least the writers aren't trying to portray her as sympathetic.

[parkerman]

I am hoping Ronnie takes him down

I know she likes to control Roxy but she is right about Dean

Matt di Angelo started filming in February 2014, so if had a 12 months contract and then extended it by another 12 months that runs till next February, with scenes aired March/April, so he's not going any time soon whatever Ronnie does.

[Dazzle]

Matt di Angelo started filing in February 2014, so if had a 12 months contract and then extended it by another 12 months that runs till next February, with scenes aired March/April, so he's not going any time soon whatever Ronnie does.

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

:angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

[parkerman]

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

:angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

Well they do say that a picture speaks a thousand words and I couldn't agree more with you.

[lizann]

im slightly worried and disgusted by dtc and matt opinion and views on rape, whether by the police or other ways linda needs justice

dtc looks to want to overlook and forget the rape

[parkerman]

Perhaps Dean gets murdered by Bobby.....

[maidmarian]

Perhaps Dean gets murdered by Bobby.....

The world loves a cheerful poster!

[maidmarian]

Perhaps Dean gets murdered by Bobby.....

The world loves a cheerful poster!

[lizann]

charlie kills dean for hurting attacking roxy and ronnie and goes on the run good storyline exit redeeming charlie too

[storyseeker1]

Actors often relish playing villains, but that doesn't mean they like their characters or approve of their actions. Now I'm not going so far as to say Matt di Angelo is OK with the rape, but he's certainly displayed no strong feelings against it in the interview we're discussing.

I'm not singling him out because this attitude appears to be endemic amongst the EE team - that's comes through loud and clear in the writing. Matt might be a lovely person and no doubt they all love working with him, but they're letting that get in the way of telling a meaningful and satisfying story. They should be using this platform to explain why rape is such a wicked crime and why the perpetrators deserve severe punishment. A surprising number of people just don't get that, which is why rape stories need handling with kid gloves. :angry:



Firstly, he's wrong that it was unexpected because there was a lot of build up to the rape what with Dean's harassment of Linda and obvious misogynistic attitude.

Secondly, it sounds dangerously like he's trying to justify it by comparing it to Shirley's crime. They are just not comparable because Dean's crime was one of taking control whereas Shirley's was one of losing control. I can't stand Shirley any more either and would be happy to see her banged up, but at least the writers aren't trying to portray her as sympathetic.

Well, it was unexpected to me, and everyone I know who watches the show. We saw that he was full of anger and everything, but we never imagined he was going to do that.

I agree that rape crimes need to be punished severely, but one of EE's themes is that they try to be as realistic as possible in every situation. And sadly, as terrible as it sounds, but a lot of rapists tend to get away with their crimes. Particularly those in Dean's case, as Linda didn't go to the police right away, so they had no evidence against him. Which is why this storyline isn't going the way a lot of people hope. Everyone wants Dean to pay, myself included, but unless he confesses or new evidence pops up, that's not gonna happen.

[Kim]

I think Dean's comeuppance was initially planned (didn't DTC say months ago that an ending had already been decided, albeit not a judicial one) but Matt Di Angelo didn't want to leave at the end of his initial contract, so they then turned to ignoring what Dean had done and making him Jade's father. Of course, being a Carter, the character was allowed to stay while others have been shoved out on DTC's say so :wall:

Big stories for the Masoods were originally supposed to air in September 2014. I guess this was Roya/Jade, but that it was then backburnered until the Rapist was freed up from the storyline with Linda, Mick and Ollie. Perhaps they even thought that Matt wouldn't want to stay since he was initially against the rape storyline.

I think in Matt's interview he is referring to it being shocking in that you wouldn't expect a good looking man/woman to be a rapist. It may also be that he was a good guy when he was first in the show, but when an actor/producer is talking about a storyline that has caused so much outrage and an OFCOM investigation (although EastEnders were cleared,) they need to be very specific so as to avoid readers/viewers misinterpreting what they meant/intended and rubbing more salt into the wound.

I wish Dean would leave and take his sperm donor with him. Kevin Wicks would be turning in his grave, for more reasons than one.

[tammyy2j]

I don't think Dean liked Roxy ending their romance, he could make her or Ronnie pay

[storyseeker1]

I think Dean's comeuppance was initially planned (didn't DTC say months ago that an ending had already been decided, albeit not a judicial one) but Matt Di Angelo didn't want to leave at the end of his initial contract, so they then turned to ignoring what Dean had done and making him Jade's father. Of course, being a Carter, the character was allowed to stay while others have been shoved out on DTC's say so :wall:

Big stories for the Masoods were originally supposed to air in September 2014. I guess this was Roya/Jade, but that it was then backburnered until the Rapist was freed up from the storyline with Linda, Mick and Ollie. Perhaps they even thought that Matt wouldn't want to stay since he was initially against the rape storyline.

I think in Matt's interview he is referring to it being shocking in that you wouldn't expect a good looking man/woman to be a rapist. It may also be that he was a good guy when he was first in the show, but when an actor/producer is talking about a storyline that has caused so much outrage and an OFCOM investigation (although EastEnders were cleared,) they need to be very specific so as to avoid readers/viewers misinterpreting what they meant/intended and rubbing more salt into the wound.

I wish Dean would leave and take his sperm donor with him. Kevin Wicks would be turning in his grave, for more reasons than one.

More or less true. Di Angelo was originally hired to play Dean only for a certain time, during which the rape would occur, and then he would leave (presumably for prison or just leave). But then DTC ending up changing their minds and asked him to stay on, presumably so they could do the Jade storyline. And now it seems they've asked him to stay on yet another year. I don't know if Di Angelo had wanted to or not, but work is work.

What's good looking got to do with being a rapist? It doesn't matter what you look like, but what you're like on the inside that matters, and Dean is damaged.

[Kim]

More or less true. Di Angelo was originally hired to play Dean only for a certain time, during which the rape would occur, and then he would leave (presumably for prison or just leave). But then DTC ending up changing their minds and asked him to stay on, presumably so they could do the Jade storyline. And now it seems they've asked him to stay on yet another year. I don't know if Di Angelo had wanted to or not, but work is work.

What's good looking got to do with being a rapist? It doesn't matter what you look like, but what you're like on the inside that matters, and Dean is damaged.

The looks point was one of the preconceptions that the storyline was intended to challenge. It was in a previous interview, I think it was one of DTC's comments about the rape storyline at the outset. It's perhaps assumed that as a good looking man, Dean wouldn't need to rape anyone since he could have his pick of women. As you say, that's not the case and it's because Dean is damaged that this happened.

[Dazzle]

Lots and lots of people are damaged but don't hurt others. This wasn't a case where someone lashed out when provoked: he made a choice to violate a completely innocent person, and there's no possible justification or excuse for that. He doesn't have a serious mental illness so he's completely responsible for the choices he made. Also, he's shown absolutely no remorse for what he did, so he's not a decent person who made a mistake. He's just someone with a huge sense of entitlement and no conscience.


I HATE it when people say EE are showing reality by letting Dean get away with it - as if the people who are complaining don't understand subtlety and nuanced writing! Showing him getting away with it could be MORE powerful if it were written to highlight the shocking rape conviction statistics and society's lax attitude to rape. That's not what's happening, it's coming across as just the opposite! EE are actually perpetuating the problem not shining a light on an injustice.

The moral of the story needs to be that rapists DESERVE a comeuppance though Dean doesn't need to be imprisoned for that. In fact, showing him getting away with it could be MORE powerful - if it were written as being an outrageous outcome and devastating to Linda. If they tack something onto the end of the story now it'll be too little too late because the damage is already done.

It's a huge problem in our society that rape and its victims are not taken seriously enough by many. That's not the case with murder and other violent crimes, which is why there's so much disgust being felt by the treatment of Dean in this storyline.

Maybe it's always been intended that Dean will rape again and that's how he's exposed. If that's the case, we shouldn't be getting the distinct feeling the writers are trying to sweep it under the carpet. It's perfectly possible for the story to be on hold for the moment and to show Dean getting on with his life in the meantime, whilst also making it clear Dean's actions were abhorrent and that he's a dangerous man. It's called good writing!

The fact is that if a significant proportion of viewers are getting the impression that Dean's being written as a bigger victim than Linda (and you only have to look on any EE forum or social media to see that's true), then something's gone very, very wrong with the writing. Whether that's deliberate or completely unintentional I've no idea, but it needs to be put right now!

[storyseeker1]

Dean being damaged is no excuse. Lots and lots of people are damaged but don't hurt others. This wasn't a case where someone lashed out when provoked: he made a choice to violate a completely innocent person, and there's no possible justification or excuse for that. He doesn't have a serious mental illness so he's completely responsible for the choices he made. Also, he's shown absolutely no remorse for what he did, so he's not a decent person who made a mistake. He's just someone with a huge sense of entitlement and no conscience.


I HATE it when people say EE are showing reality by letting Dean get away with it - as if the people who are complaining don't understand subtlety and nuanced writing! Showing him getting away with it could be MORE powerful if it were written to highlight the shocking rape conviction statistics and society's lax attitude to rape. That's not what's happening, it's coming across as just the opposite! EE are actually perpetuating the problem not shining a light on an injustice.

The moral of the story needs to be that rapists DESERVE a comeuppance but Dean doesn't need to be imprisoned for that. In fact, showing him getting away with it could be more powerful - if it were written as being an outrageous outcome and devastating to Linda. If they tack something onto the end of the story now it'll be too little too late because the damage is already done.

It's a huge problem in our society that rape and its victims are not taken seriously enough by many. That's not the case with murder and other violent crimes, which is why there's so much disgust being felt by the treatment of Dean in this storyline.

Maybe it's always been intended that Dean will rape again and that's how he's exposed. If that's the case, we shouldn't be getting the distinct feeling the writers are trying to sweep it under the carpet. It's perfectly possible for the story to be on hold for the moment and to show Dean getting on with his life in the meantime, whilst also making it clear Dean's actions were abhorrent and that he's a dangerous man. It's called good writing!

The fact is that if a significant proportion of viewers are getting the impression that Dean's being written as a bigger victim than Linda (and you only have to look on any EE forum or social media to see that's true), then something's gone very, very wrong with the writing. Whether that's deliberate or completely unintentional I've no idea, but it needs to be put right now!

I didn't mean he was damaged as an excuse. I just mean he's damaged plural, as in dangerous, psycho or whatever you wanna call it.

Well, unfortunately that's the way EE is writing it. Don't misunderstand me, as I hate Dean getting away with it, and want him to pay for his crime. But I can understand why EE wrote it the way they did, because sadly unless new evidence turns up then this is the most realistic way everything would turn out. And part of the reason why I and a lot watch EE is because of their realistic writing, because the sad fact is that not everything ends with a happy ending. But I think we can safely say that they are not finished with Dean yet. He's obviously still dangerous, by the way he reacted when Roxy seemed to dump him. Like you say, maybe Dean will hurt someone again and he will be punished then. EE did say that Dean would pay for his crime, but didn't mention how. I guess this is the best we can hope for.

[Dazzle]

But I can understand why EE wrote it the way they did, because sadly unless new evidence turns up then this is the most realistic way everything would turn out. And part of the reason why I and a lot watch EE is because of their realistic writing, because the sad fact is that not everything ends with a happy ending.

You've misunderstood what I said if you think what I'm asking for in my last post is a happy ending. It's perfectly possible to write a realistic story about a rapist getting away with his crime where the rape is treated sensitively and the rapist not be portrayed as a victim. It's called good writing.

[storyseeker1]

You've misunderstood what I said if you think what I'm asking for in my last post is a happy ending. It's perfectly possible to write a realistic story about a rapist getting away with his crime where the rape is treated sensitively and the rapist not be portrayed as a victim. It's called good writing.

Ah. Well I can't comment on that, as I'm not a writer. When Dean got away with the rape I stopped watching for a while, and then the Jade story started... It's just all messed up. I wish EE had never done the rape story, or used another character to do it.

[Dazzle]

I wish EE had never done the rape story, or used another character to do it.

I certainly agree with you there. I used to quite like Dean and was glad when I heard he was returning to the square. I really, really wanted his and Shirley's relationship to be explored and mended. That's been ruined for me forever now. :(

[Kim]

I didn't mean he was damaged as an excuse. I just mean he's damaged plural, as in dangerous, psycho or whatever you wanna call it.

Yes, me too. His thinking is about as skewked as it could get and that makes him so dangerous. In the rape episode itself, it seemed that his prime motivation was that Linda saw him as a son almost and he didn't want that. Something's wrong in his head as he didn't see politely telling her that he wasn't comfortable with that and wanted to be seen as a nephew instead (which he/they thought he was, except for the technicality that Linda and Mick aren't married) as an option. Dean was a nice guy when he first arrived but his actions got more and more questionable (especially after his prison stint) until he became totally despicable. It was clear months ago that he saw women as objects to be controlled and it's evident in his reaction to being dumped.

Dean's continuing presence wouldn't be so infuriating if he wasn't aware of what he'd done and it wasn't so black and white. Linda clearly said no and he knows what he did. He's gone into denial because he doesn't like what that makes him. That, for me, makes his continuing presence unacceptable. The storyline could have been written to give him some redeeming features from the outset (remorse for his crime, it not being so clear cut, etc.) Even him having the decency to stay well away from Linda, Mick and Ollie (in particular) would have been better than nothing. Obviously the proper way for him to show remorse would have been to turn himself into the police, but anything would have better than what we got (I assume because the intention at the time was for him to leave Walford somehow and for the story to illustrate the importance of rape being reported to the police as soon as possible.) One of the messages should have been that verbal consent should be sought but the only time that was touched on was when Dean and his huge attitude were being questioned.

[tammyy2j]

EastEnders fans have voiced their concerns at how Dean Wicks is being portrayed in the show after raping Linda Carter (Kellie Bright).

One branded the character - who is played by Matt Di Angelo - "Walford's new Casanova" and questioned why he is able to walk around with "girls falling at his feet" following his recent romantic liaisons with Roxy Mitchell (Rita Simons).

They wrote: "He is walking around with girls falling at his feet, cracking jokes like the main man at the party and suddenly he is everyone's friend. He even talks about being able to get 'it' whenever he wants... its foul."

But some EastEnders fans clearly have short memories as executive producer Dominic Treadwell-Collins promised way back in April that Dean will get his comeuppance in a "shocking" way.

He said: "There will be justice. And how it's meted out will be satisfying but shocking too."

Despite this, another viewer insisted it is "unnecessary" to portray Dean as an "all-round great guy".

They posted: "Yes, we all know that Deano escaping punishment for rape is, sadly, very realistic.

"But portraying Dean as an all-round great guy? Totally unnecessary, insensitive and insulting to viewers' intelligence."

However, there are other fans who think Dean's portrayal is realistic and completely understand the show's portrayal of the evil character.

One wrote: "I find the fact he hasn't been shunned to be totally realistic if I'm honest. It happens. I used to work in an office with a guy who beat his wife on a pretty regular basis. We all knew and he knew that we knew. Fair enough, we weren't 'friends' with him, but we didn't shun him either."

Another wrote: "Don't get me wrong I loathe Dean and he needs exterminating. However he hasn't been charged or convicted so in the law he's innocent. Therefore why should he be shunned. Only the audience and the carters know the truth"

http://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/viewers-slam-eastenders-rapist-dean-6280513#rlabs=1

[lizann]

will he beat or even rape roxy, i even think he could have got rid of charlie

[Dazzle]

will he beat or even rape roxy, i even think he could have got rid of charlie

It looks like Roxy's in for a bad time with Dean. :(

I do like the idea of Dean getting rid of Charlie, but I'm still certain DTC won't have killed off Dot's grandson.

[lizann]

maybe vincent and ronnie threatened dot if charlie didn't leave and then dean really got rid, the wallet in the bin looks like a sinister end for charlie, wallet in bin near massod food stall for roxy to find

[tammyy2j]

It has been a year now since the rape, so time for him to face his punishment and comeuppance

[storyseeker1]

Well, it sounds like Dean is "finally" going to get his comeuppance! About time, too!

http://beta.digitalspy.co.uk/soaps/eastenders/news/a675105/is-eastenders-star-matt-di-angelo-leaving-his-dean-wicks-role/

[Dazzle]

I'm over the moon that what looks to be the beginning of the end for Dean has begun now Ronnie wants rid of him "the East End" way. I really like the thought of her and Linda being involved in his comeuppance. I just hope that whatever happens, Dean admits his guilt so Linda's vindicated.

The news that Matt di Angelo is leaving is the icing on the cake! :thumbsup:

[parkerman]

I just hope that whatever happens, Dean admits his guilt so Linda's vindicated.


Yes, this is the crucial part of all this. It's all very well getting rid of him, but the truth about his rape of Linda has to be made clear to everyone.

[storyseeker1]

I'm over the moon that what looks to be the beginning of the end for Dean has begun now Ronnie wants rid of him "the East End" way. I really like the thought of her and Linda being involved in his comeuppance. I just hope that whatever happens, Dean admits his guilt so Linda's vindicated.

The news that Matt di Angelo is leaving is the icing on the cake! :thumbsup:

Well, I'm happy Dean will be getting what's coming to him, though I am sorry Matt is leaving, as I like his acting. I wonder what's going to happen to Jade though?

[Dazzle]

Well, I'm happy Dean will be getting what's coming to him, though I am sorry Matt is leaving, as I like his acting. I wonder what's going to happen to Jade though?

Yes, I've got nothing against Matt and I actually used to like Dean, but I'm just very glad the character's going. Hopefully, Shabnam won't change her mind about getting custody of Jade, and Shirley and Buster can have regular contact.

[storyseeker1]

Yes, I've got nothing against Matt and I actually used to like Dean, but I'm just very glad the character's going. Hopefully, Shabnam won't change her mind about getting custody of Jade, and Shirley and Buster can have regular contact.

Well, they should do. I mean, even if Jade goes to live with Shabs after all, Shirley is the one who has experience with dealing with someone who has CF.

[Perdita]

Well, they should do. I mean, even if Jade goes to live with Shabs after all, Shirley is the one who has experience with dealing with someone who has CF.

She left Kevin and Jimbo though cause she could not handle it if I remember correctly

[storyseeker1]

She left Kevin and Jimbo though cause she could not handle it if I remember correctly

Technically she left because of emotional guilt (she blamed herself because she nearly drowned Mick as a baby, and got it into her head that Jimbo was being punished for her actions). But either way, she didn't leave him until some time while he was a little kid, so she was there for a few years and thus has experience in caring for someone with CF.

[storyseeker1]

I wonder if Mick knows what he's truly doing. I mean, I was all for Dean getting his comeuppance, but murder??? As despicable as he is, he is still Mick's brother and Shirley's son. Does Mick really think he can kill him and be able to look his mom in the face again, knowing he killed her youngest son? And will he be able to look into Jade's face, knowing he killed her father? Plus, as vengeful as he is, Mick doesn't seem the type who can kill, or at least kill and not feel guilty about it. And what if he gets caught; what will happen to his family then?

It seems to me that he's acting all on impulse, and not thinking things through clearly enough.

[lizann]

don't think it will be mick killing dean more likely roxy or ronnie

[maidmarian]

I wonder if Mick knows what he's truly doing. I mean, I was all for Dean getting his comeuppance, but murder??? As despicable as he is, he is still Mick's brother and Shirley's son. Does Mick really think he can kill him and be able to look his mom in the face again, knowing he killed her youngest son? And will he be able to look into Jade's face, knowing he killed her father? Plus, as vengeful as he is, Mick doesn't seem the type who can kill, or at least kill and not feel guilty about it. And what if he gets caught; what will happen to his family then?

It seems to me that he's acting all on impulse, and not thinking things through clearly enough.

The main tbing to me is Dean is removed
and punished and Linda is believed and
her reputation restored.

I agree if Mick "kills" Dean - in one
way he falls to his level.
If it is that Mick kills Dean -he should
consider the possibility of getting caught
( tho it depends how its done-dont
always get caught in soaps)

The results could be an effect on his own
self respect
Being parted from Linda for many years
and the effect of that on Linda and himself.
They are good couple and she has been
through a lot already in the last year.

The effect on his children- their father
labelled as a killer - albeit of scum.

But I dont think he should concern
himself unduly about Shirley. Apart
from the biological fact of having given
birth - the word Mother means whatever
each woman has made it mean to her
family by her actions over years!
In the case of Shirley - that doesnt seem
to be much.Shes a very selfish person-
putting it mildly.

So.I hope there is a way of getting rid
of Dean and vindicating Linda - without
too much detrimental effect on Mick
Linda & their children.

Everyone knows rapists arent always
caught but the storyline has strayed so
much from the original.idea and become
skewed by the PTBs preference for Dean
- that it has lost a lot of effectiveness.

[Dazzle]

I wonder if Mick knows what he's truly doing. I mean, I was all for Dean getting his comeuppance, but murder??? As despicable as he is, he is still Mick's brother and Shirley's son. Does Mick really think he can kill him and be able to look his mom in the face again, knowing he killed her youngest son? And will he be able to look into Jade's face, knowing he killed her father? Plus, as vengeful as he is, Mick doesn't seem the type who can kill, or at least kill and not feel guilty about it. And what if he gets caught; what will happen to his family then?

It seems to me that he's acting all on impulse, and not thinking things through clearly enough.

I agree, I don't think Mick's got it in him to kill. He understandably feels murderous at the moment but that doesn't mean he'll be able to go through with it. Of course, he'll have Ronnie encouraging him now, but I'm pretty sure that if they plan to murder Dean, Mick will come to his senses and try stop it.

[Dazzle]

But I dont think he should concern
himself unduly about Shirley. Apart
from the biological fact of having given
birth - the word Mother means whatever
each woman has made it mean to her
family by her actions over years!
In the case of Shirley - that doesnt seem
to be much.Shes a very selfish person-
putting it mildly.

I totally agree. After the way Shirley harassed and abused Linda after the rape was revealed, I don't personally think Mick should ever forgive her. If she was any kind of mother, she wouldn't have devastated Mick like that whether she believed Linda was lying or not. :angry:

Of course, this being a soap we know it'll all be forgiven and forgotten before long. It's started already...

[storyseeker1]

But I dont think he should concern
himself unduly about Shirley. Apart
from the biological fact of having given
birth - the word Mother means whatever
each woman has made it mean to her
family by her actions over years!
In the case of Shirley - that doesnt seem
to be much.Shes a very selfish person-
putting it mildly..

Remember, though, that unlike the rest of her kids, Shirley did actually raise Mick. Of course he didn't know she was his mother, but she was there for him while he was growing up after her mom left.


I totally agree. After the way Shirley harassed and abused Linda after the rape was revealed, I don't personally think Mick should ever forgive her. If she was any kind of mother, she wouldn't have devastated Mick like that whether she believed Linda was lying or not. :angry:

Of course, this being a soap we know it'll all be forgiven and forgotten before long. It's started already...

Maybe, but don't forget that Dean is her son too. Plus, she feels a lot of guilt concerning Dean, because she abandoned him as a child etc. I believe she tends to let her feelings of guilt override her sense. Plus, don't forget that she wasn't the only one who didn't believe Linda. There are several other people on the square who are sceptic about her as well.

[maidmarian]

Remember, though, that unlike the rest of her kids, Shirley did actually raise Mick. Of course he didn't know she was his mother, but she was there for him while he was growing up after her mom left.



Maybe, but don't forget that Dean is her son too. Plus, she feels a lot of guilt concerning Dean, because she abandoned him as a child etc. I believe she tends to let her feelings of guilt override her sense. Plus, don't forget that she wasn't the only one who didn't believe Linda. There are several other people on the square who are sceptic about her as well.

What happened in Micks childhood was a long
time ago. In families where the mother dies or
deserts older siblings do often take help care of the
younger ones -but thats not the same as raising
a child.

If she does feel guilt over the way she deserted
Dean - shes an adult and should make some
attempt to accept responsibiity -not take her
guilt out on other people. She is not only selfish
as I said before but also self- centred.

Its true that other people didnt believe Linda
but they were neighbours/ strangers with
little previous knowledge of Linda.
Shirley is a family member whether its as a
mother- or sister- in law. I would hope that in
most families than unless there was
overwhelming evidence to the contrary
or previous behaviour that cast doubt -the
family member would be believed.

The SWs can decide on a scenario but unless
the detailed writing and the acting supports
that scenario you end up with a botch- up.
And the cracks will be papered over in
an unbelievable " Soap "way - as Dazzle
suggests.

The Rape story was initially a good idea- but
theyve let spin and unrealistic dramatics
& some ret- conning ruin it. And it is a very
important issue!

[Dazzle]

Plus, don't forget that she wasn't the only one who didn't believe Linda. There are several other people on the square who are sceptic about her as well.

The point I was trying to make is that, irrespective of whether she believed Linda or not, Shirley's bullying behaviour towards Linda (and by extension Mick) was appalling. And it wasn't just her initial reaction, it continued for many months. If she truly was a loving mother, she would have been a lot more circumspect in her behaviour so as not to hurt Mick. That's what I find unforgivable.

[tammyy2j]

I wonder if Mick knows what he's truly doing. I mean, I was all for Dean getting his comeuppance, but murder??? As despicable as he is, he is still Mick's brother and Shirley's son. Does Mick really think he can kill him and be able to look his mom in the face again, knowing he killed her youngest son? And will he be able to look into Jade's face, knowing he killed her father? Plus, as vengeful as he is, Mick doesn't seem the type who can kill, or at least kill and not feel guilty about it. And what if he gets caught; what will happen to his family then?

It seems to me that he's acting all on impulse, and not thinking things through clearly enough.

I don't want Dean killed off by Mick either, I know there is no way back for him after the rape so he cant be redeemed but I want him to admit his guilt so all will hear

Mick was wise calling off Ronnie's hit plan tonight at least

[maidmarian]

I don't want Dean killed off by Mick either, I know there is no way back for him after the rape so he cant be redeemed but I want him to admit his guilt so all will hear

Mick was wise calling off Ronnie's hit plan tonight at least

If Mick does kill Dean it could have
devastating effects on him and his
family for years to come-if hes found
out.
Dean would be dead but in a way he
would have "won" again as hes ruined
the familys life and still no real vindication
for Linda.
On a practical note I would say anyone
entering on a joint enterprise murder
would be better off with a more "steady"
partner than Ronnie!

[storyseeker1]

Yeah, Ronnie is definitely the unstable one.

[Perdita]

EastEnders' Ronnie Mitchell will find her worst fears happening when her sister Roxy gets engaged to dangerous Dean Wicks next week.

Upcoming scenes will see Ronnie (Samantha Woman) adopt new tactics in an attempt to get him out of Roxy's life for good, but she will soon realise that Dean is a force to be reckoned with when he takes drastic action.

Deciding she needs to win Dean over, Ronnie continues to push forward with her plan but her intentions falter when she learns Dean and Roxy are set to move out of London.
http://i1.cdnds.net/15/44/618x412/soaps-eastenders-w45-5170-02.jpg
Ronnie calls Billy with a proposition
© BBC
Ronnie calls Billy with a proposition

After trying her luck with Mick and failing, Ronnie seemingly concedes to their plan and agrees to see if she can buy out Roxy's share of the house. As night falls, Ronnie gives Billy the keys to Blades and tells him they're going to put Dean out of business to ensure that Roxy that can't leave.

Tensions run high later when Dean discovers Blades has been broken into and he immediately directs his anger onto Roxy, blaming her for leaving the keys in the door.
http://i1.cdnds.net/15/44/618x436/soaps-eastenders-w45-5171-03.jpg
Dean finds everything has been stolen from Blades
© BBC
Dean finds everything has been stolen from Blades

As Roxy goes off to fix the problem, the penny drops for Dean and he realises who really is to blame. When Ronnie arrives at Dean's flat, it doesn't take her long to realise that she's been caught out and she later finds herself in an impossible situation when Roxy returns.

However, Dean's plan soon begins to fall apart as well when Ronnie shares a harsh truth with him. Knowing he needs to take drastic action, Dean then proposes to Roxy, who happily accepts.
http://i2.cdnds.net/15/44/618x432/soaps-eastenders-w45-5172-03.jpg
Ronnie puts her plan into action
© BBC
Ronnie puts her plan into action
http://i2.cdnds.net/15/44/618x420/soaps-eastenders-w45-5172-04.jpg
Ronnie puts her plan into action
© BBC
Ronnie puts her plan into action

As Roxy and a smug Dean happily celebrate their engagement, a desperate Ronnie turns to her family in a bid to intervene but despite their disapproval, Roxy pushes forward with her engagement party regardless.

However, both Roxy and Dean are shocked when Ronnie arrives and apologises for her earlier behaviour, but her true intentions soon become clear.

With Roxy back on side, Ronnie takes matters into her own hands and attempts to show Roxy what Dean is really like, but will her plan work?
http://i1.cdnds.net/15/44/618x441/soaps-eastenders-w45-5172-09.jpg
Will Ronnie's plan to expose Dean work?
© BBC
Will Ronnie's plan to expose Dean work?
http://i1.cdnds.net/15/44/618x446/soaps-eastenders-w45-5172-10.jpg
Will Ronnie's plan to expose Dean work?
© BBC
Will Ronnie's plan to expose Dean work?

EastEnders airs these scenes on Monday November 9, Tuesday November 10 and Thursday November 12 on BBC One.


digitalspy

[lizann]

we now know mick and linda wedding is by a lake and mick has a water stunt so ronnie breaks up roxy and dean, could be with mick's help, dean gatecrashes the wedding and he fights mick in the lake or saves mick or linda or nancy but is lost in the lake presumed death only to return later to terrorise ronnie, just my theory

[tammyy2j]

I hope a drunk or sober Dean lets slip at the wedding his guilt for raping Linda, she needs to be believed by everyone and Shirley needs to grovel to her for forgiveness

[Perdita]

EastEnders​ villain Dean Wicks will attempt to rape his girlfriend Roxy Mitchell in the build-up to his exit from the show.

The soap's team have been working with the charity Rape Crisis while planning the storyline, which will air on screen towards the end of the year.

Dean has been dating Roxy (Rita Simons) for a few months, much to the concern of Roxy's sister Ronnie.

Viewers have already seen signs that their relationship could take a darker turn, as Dean's controlling behaviour has led to him burning Roxy with hair straighteners. He also cut off a chunk of her hair when they were rowing last month.

The plot is now building towards a dark conclusion when Dean leaves Roxy traumatised by trying to rape her.

Backing ​EastEnders​ for exploring the issue once again, a Rape Crisis spokesperson told The Mirror: ​"EastEnders has covered every other conceivable issue. If sexual violence or rape was the only big topic EastEnders never approached, it would reinforce the idea sexual violence is unspeakable.

"Because people relate to soaps they can have a social impact and make people feel less alone or encourage them to come forward and seek support for the first time."

Hair salon owner Dean raped his sister-in-law Linda Carter (Kellie Bright) last year, but he wasn't punished for his crime as the authorities chose not to bring the case to trial.

Some of the Square's residents have been wary of Dean since, but he has managed to fool a number of the locals with his seemingly-charming demeanour.

Matt Di Angelo, who plays Dean, will be leaving ​EastEnders​ within the next few months. It's thought that his exit could air at the start of 2016, when Linda and Mick's New Year wedding leads to a dramatic water-based stunt.

An ​EastEnders​ spokesperson recently commented: ​"We can confirm that Matt will be leaving and we wish him all the best."​

[storyseeker1]

I will be sorry to see Matt go, but glad that the story involving Dean will finally be resolved.

So... Who thinks what is gonna happen? I'm gonna guess and say that after Dean tries to rape Roxy, he tries to make a run for it, but ends up falling into a lake/river. Mick is then faced with the big decision of whether to let the man who raped his wife drown, or save his brother? After a big mental ordeal, he then dives in to save him, followed by Dean being arrested. Even if Dean doesn't confess to raping Linda, it won't matter, as the fact that he tried to rape Roxy will prove once and for all that he's a rapist, and that Linda had to be telling the truth after all.

[Dazzle]

I agree, I think Mick will save Dean from drowning.

Dean's attempted rape of Roxy probably costs him everything (even Shirley's love). He'll possibly turn up at Mick and Linda's wedding intent on destroying their happiness.

Thank goodness everyone will see Dean for what he is at last! I've seen complaints elsewhere about the second (attempted) rape, but he's got away with it once so it's entirely probable he'd try it again. I've heard that rapists are often serial offenders (and why wouldn't they be if they go unpunished and believe they've done nothing wrong :wall:).

[storyseeker1]

I agree, I think Mick will save Dean from drowning.

Dean's attempted rape of Roxy probably costs him everything (even Shirley's love). He'll possibly turn up at Mick and Linda's wedding intent on destroying their happiness.

Thank goodness everyone will see Dean for what he is at last! I've seen complaints elsewhere about the second (attempted) rape, but he's got away with it once so it's entirely probable he'd try it again. I've heard that rapists are often serial offenders (and why wouldn't they be if they go unpunished and believe they've done nothing wrong :wall:).

Not so sure about losing Shirley's love, as she'll probably blame herself for what he's become. I often wondered if Dean would have become the man he is now if he never gone to jail in the first place? Mick and Linda's wedding is probably the place where he'll try to rape Roxy, though what he'll be doing there I have no idea.

Oh yeah, I totally agree. Every rapist in history I've heard about, especially those who were never punished, often end up doing it again. I mean, I have heard about some who do truly regret their actions and tried to get their lives back on track by admitting their crimes, going to prison, having therapy etc, but those type of men are rare.

[lizann]

don't think mick is a good swimmer, ian gave him what one lesson

[storyseeker1]

don't think mick is a good swimmer, ian gave him what one lesson

There was an ep where Mick did a sponsored swimming marathon of some sort.

[Kim]

don't think mick is a good swimmer, ian gave him what one lesson

He isn't really. He just about managed one length and by New Year it'll be coming up for 18 months ago. He's probably got worse in that time, not having gone swimming since.

[lizann]

There was an ep where Mick did a sponsored swimming marathon of some sort.

oh yes was that for janet, billy's daughter but he managed 1 lap was it of the pool

[lizann]

There was an ep where Mick did a sponsored swimming marathon of some sort.

oh yes was that for janet, billy's daughter but he managed 1 lap was it of the pool

[Kim]

oh yes was that for janet, billy's daughter but he managed 1 lap was it of the pool

One length and then Dean threw a strop because everyone was proud of Mick rather than him, despite his having done 19 lengths or something.

[Dazzle]

We know Mick is a poor swimmer and also had to overcome a phobia of the water to do the sponsored swim. He probably still has major issues with going in the water. These facts were what made me think Mick would end up rescuing Dean when I heard about the water stunt that would form the climax of the rape storyline. Soaps do so love to wring every ounce of melodrama from a situation... :D


Not so sure about losing Shirley's love, as she'll probably blame herself for what he's become.

You might have a point about Shirley feeling guilty, but I'm positive she won't want Dean around any more when she hears the truth. She might even call the police on him. She certainly needs to do something to redeem herself.

[lizann]

Yeah, Ronnie is definitely the unstable one.

in some weird twisted way was ronnie coming on to dean tonight or was it in my head

think ronnie will push dean into attempting to rape roxy, she will get roxy back and away from dean

think dean will die saving mick or one of his kids, lee depression pushes him more to drinking, nancy has fits

id prefer mick saving dean who then goes jail

[Dazzle]

id prefer mick saving dean who then goes jail

That's what I'd like too. There's potentially lots of good drama to be had in Mick - who's a poor swimmer - having to overcome his fear of the water to rescue his wife's rapist. Maybe he nearly kills him and then changes his mind and saves his life?

[maidmarian]

That's what I'd like too. There's potentially lots of good drama to be had in Mick - who's a poor swimmer - having to overcome his fear of the water to rescue his wife's rapist. Maybe he nearly kills him and then changes his mind and saves his life?

It would be good if that happened. If Mick
can do that- there is punishment for Dean
justice for Linda and Mick and his familys
life are not ruined.
I was quite keen on vengeance initially
but that only brings the avenger down
to the level of the criminal - which does
have an adverse effect - unless they are
a very hard person.

[Rear window]

Maybe Mick falls in and Dean saves him? Not sure where any confession would come?
Maybe Mick has been secretly practising swimming?
Maybe the plot-editor thought we'd forget he only managed a length?

[Rear window]

Maybe Mick falls in and Dean saves him? Not sure where any confession would come?
Maybe Mick has been secretly practising swimming?
Maybe the plot-editor thought we'd forget he only managed a length?

[parkerman]

Maybe the plot-editor thought we'd forget he only managed a length?

I would think, whatever happens, the whole point of the stunt will be around the fact that Mick hates the water and can't swim very well.

[tammyy2j]

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/showbiz-tv/hot-tv/474471/Eastenders-drown-and-out-Deano-left-fighting-for-life

Our exclusive first-look photos give fans a peek at the scenes that will rock Albert Square.

Evil Dean, played by Matt Di Angelo, appears to drown in a lake in a dramatic episode on New Year’s Day.

In a surprise twist his brother Mick Carter will attempt to save him after dragging his body out of the water.

The Queen Vic landlord, played by Danny Dyer, steps in despite knowing Dean raped his other half Linda.

As our snaps show, dad Buster Briggs then tries and apparently fails to revive Dean.

The cast shot the scenes on location in St Albans.

An onlooker said: “It was gripping stuff. Viewers are in for a real treat.”

It emerged last week Dean will attempt to rape Roxy Mitchell in the run-up to Christmas.

He will end up in the lake on the day of Mick and Linda’s wedding, which will be screened on January 1.

Kellie Bright, who plays Linda, took time out from Strictly to shoot the scenes.

Shirley and Tina Carter were also involved in filming the scenes.

[Dazzle]

Why give so much of the plot away? Presumably this was sanctioned by the EE team. http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/confused/smileys-confused-630530.gif (http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/)

I can't say I'm sorry to see an apparently lifeless Dean though...

[tammyy2j]

Why give so much of the plot away? Presumably this was sanctioned by the EE team. http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/confused/smileys-confused-630530.gif (http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/)

I can't say I'm sorry to see an apparently lifeless Dean though...

I like the idea of Mick being the better man saving Dean who then faces prison and outcast by everyone

Buster and Shirley must get invited to the wedding

[maidmarian]

Why give so much of the plot away? Presumably this was sanctioned by the EE team. http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/confused/smileys-confused-630530.gif (http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/)

I can't say I'm sorry to see an apparently lifeless Dean though...

Neither am I -it would be the best solution
and as Tammy says leaves Mick shown as
the better man and his life not adversely
affected as it would have been if he had
killed Dean and been caught.

Why show so much-??

1) Dean.isnt lifeless .No one there is
medically trained.?? He is revived and
the story continues-hopefully to a legal
conclusion- but we have had a twist and
been shocked.

2) He is dead. They are worried that the
story has gone for so long with so
many "false" promises about justice - that
a sizeable% of audience are disinterested/
disbelieving that they may not watch-unless
shown that there will be a conclusion.

Sorry to sound cynical( have thought of
worse twists there could be!!) but
just hope it is as it seems-tho any surprise
gone!!

[tammyy2j]

I hate her predictable the show has become with no shocks or surprises

[storyseeker1]

That report from the dailystar doesn't actually say for certain that Dean dies. It uses words like, "Evil Dean, played by Matt Di Angelo, appears to drown in a lake" and "Buster Briggs then tries and apparently fails to revive Dean". With these words, they could be true, but there's still a chance that Dean may not die after all. Either way, his time on EE is up, because even if he lives he'll spend the next several years in prison.

EE has used this trick before. When Barbara Windsor was leaving EE, the stories leading up to her finale indicated that Peggy Mitchell was gonna die in the big fire at the Vic, but in the end she survived and merely walked out of the show.

[Dazzle]

That report from the dailystar doesn't actually say for certain that Dean dies. It uses words like, "Evil Dean, played by Matt Di Angelo, appears to drown in a lake" and "Buster Briggs then tries and apparently fails to revive Dean". With these words, they could be true, but there's still a chance that Dean may not die after all. Either way, his time on EE is up, because even if he lives he'll spend the next several years in prison.

I don't think any of us assumed Dean definitely dies. My comment about giving so much of the plot away was referring to giving away what happens during the water stunt (ie that Mick rescues Dean).

[Perdita]

Matt Di Angelo - aka EastEnders baddie Dean Wicks - has revealed that he needs a break from the soap because it is so emotionally exhausting for him.

Having had to contend with storylines such as Dean raping his sister-in-law Linda Carter and the death of Dean's grandfather, Di Angelo has said that he often struggles to switch off his emotions after filming.

"When I'm acting I tap into what's happening in my life," he told the Daily Mail's Femail magazine. "For example, when Dean's grandfather Stan died, my own grandad had recently passed away and I went to that place.

"Once I got there I was genuinely sobbing. Then when they say 'Cut' you don't stop crying; you're really bawling and short of breath. I sometimes go to my dressing room and cry."

Di Angelo added that he often becomes physically exhausted from having to portray so many difficult scenes.

"I'm in a bad way afterwards because I'm physically drained from the emotion I have to pour out," he said.

"In the same way toddlers cry themselves to sleep, it's exhausting. I've been crying all day – I'm not going to go home and be happy."

The actor said that while he has relished the challenges that come with playing such a dark character, he would struggle to play the role for too long.

"Actors do whatever we are asked and it's awesome to get these roles," he said. "It was more the extended time I was going to have to play it for that made me nervous."

And although Dean will soon be departing the Square in an exit storyline that's been kept under wraps, the actor has joked that there is every chance he could return again one day.

"It's a soap. Every door and every window is always open!" he said. Sure is in EastEnders :p

[tammyy2j]

I thought Matt was leaving soon?

[Kissinger]

I thought DEan was amazing in his row with Shirley, he was so real, best bit of acting on EE for agesssssssssss do you hear Vincent?????

[storyseeker1]

Btw, would someone remind me... When Shirley's daughter Carley made a brief reappearance, back when Shirley was struggling with Heather's murder and everything, she said Dean was in Australia working as a barman with a girlfriend. Was that true? Did he ever go to Australia, or did Carley make it all up, or was it never addressed when he came back? Because I'm curious about why he would return to Britain, and whatever happened to that girlfriend of his?

[Perdita]

That is what Carley said but I don´t think it has ever been referred to again .. don´t remember an explanation as to why he returned to Walford ...

[lizann]

thought dean was with stan for a good while maybe since leaving square

[alcapo11]

Eastenders ruined Dean, it would of been good to see his relationship with Mick and the rest of his family. He was originally an irritating idiot, he came back and showed potential to be a bad boy/villain then they turn him into a rapist.

[parkerman]

That is what Carley said but I don´t think it has ever been referred to again .. don´t remember an explanation as to why he returned to Walford ...


thought dean was with stan for a good while maybe since leaving square

When he reappeared in EE, it was to be with Stan, but I don't think the fact he'd been in Australia was actually referred to.


Eastenders ruined Dean, it would of been good to see his relationship with Mick and the rest of his family. He was originally an irritating idiot, he came back and showed potential to be a bad boy/villain then they turn him into a rapist.

Absolutely. Exploring the relationship with Mick, Shirley and the rest would have been a much better use of Dean and Matt's talents.

[Rear window]

When he reappeared in EE, it was to be with Stan, but I don't think the fact he'd been in Australia was actually referred to.



Absolutely. Exploring the relationship with Mick, Shirley and the rest would have been a much better use of Dean and Matt's talents.

There was quite a complex set of relationships with people to explore for a long time, but the rape storyline made it all irrelevant. Shocking storylines are not good for developing characters.

[Rear window]

When he reappeared in EE, it was to be with Stan, but I don't think the fact he'd been in Australia was actually referred to.



Absolutely. Exploring the relationship with Mick, Shirley and the rest would have been a much better use of Dean and Matt's talents.

There was quite a complex set of relationships with people to explore for a long time, but the rape storyline made it all irrelevant. Shocking storylines are not good for developing characters.

[tammyy2j]

Got to say Matt's acting cant be faulted in this storyline brilliantly played

[alcapo11]

When he reappeared in EE, it was to be with Stan, but I don't think the fact he'd been in Australia was actually referred to.



Absolutely. Exploring the relationship with Mick, Shirley and the rest would have been a much better use of Dean and Matt's talents.

Like Mick said last episode it could of been so different, giving Dean a proper family would of been a much better storyline. They just used him to make the public love Mick and Linda imo.

[alcapo11]

When he reappeared in EE, it was to be with Stan, but I don't think the fact he'd been in Australia was actually referred to.



Absolutely. Exploring the relationship with Mick, Shirley and the rest would have been a much better use of Dean and Matt's talents.

Like Mick said last episode it could of been so different, giving Dean a proper family would of been a much better storyline. They just used him to make the public love Mick and Linda imo.

[storyseeker1]

Matt Di Angelo states in his tweeter that New Years special was not Dean's final scenes. I hope that it will just be some scenes of him in jail, because if it turns out the police let him go again just because Roxy has left, I will flood the writers with hate mail!

http://www.digitalspy.com/soaps/eastenders/news/a778560/eastenders-star-matt-di-angelo-hints-we-havent-seen-the-last-of-dean-yet/

[Dazzle]

Let's hope the scenes will be of him pleading guilty and being locked up.

[Rear window]

Let's hope the scenes will be of him pleading guilty and being locked up.

That's probably the best end his character could have. If they are planning on ever bringing him back the start of his repentance.

[kaz21]

What's happen to deans trial? It seems to have been forgotten about.

[Dazzle]

What's happen to deans trial? It seems to have been forgotten about.

Yes, we were told it was going to be held in June.

[Perdita]

Yes, we were told it was going to be held in June. Which June? There is a backlog of court cases, you know, they don´t happen within days ...... :cartman: unless you are in soapland of course

[Dazzle]

Which June? There is a backlog of court cases, you know, they don´t happen within days ...... :cartman: unless you are in soapland of course

Since the year wasn't mentioned I assumed they meant this one! :p

[Perdita]

Since the year wasn't mentioned I assumed they meant this one! :p
I would have done the same :D

[kaz21]

thanks, I was sure they had said June or july

[Perdita]

Emotions will run high on EastEnders next week as the residents wait to hear the outcome of Dean Wicks's trial.

Dean (Matt Di Angelo) is standing trial for attempting to rape Roxy Mitchell at the end of last year, but she will make a shocking discovery in the days leading up to the court case.

With the trial fast approaching, Roxy (Rita Simons) is fuming to discover that Ronnie has written to Dean asking him to plead guilty.

As reality hits home for Roxy, supportive Jack and Ronnie both help her prepare for what's ahead. Despite this, as Roxy prepares to give evidence, she tells her sister that she wants to face it on her own.
http://digitalspyuk.cdnds.net/16/31/768x524/gallery-1470573540-soaps-eastenders-ronnie-mitchell-roxy-mitchell.jpg
Roxy Mitchell tells Ronnie how it went in court in EastEnders
© BBC
Dean's mother Shirley (Linda Henry) will also prepare to give evidence and will turn to Denise Fox and her love rival Kathy Beale for support. However, Shirley admits to Mick later that it didn't go well at the trial and she blames herself for being a bad mother.

After everyone has done their bit in court, the Albert Square residents face an anxious night after learning the verdict will be revealed as soon as the following day.
http://digitalspyuk.cdnds.net/16/31/768x512/gallery-1470575640-soaps-eastenders-shirley-carter-denise-fox-1.jpg
Shirley Carter considers buying booze to get her through Dean's trial in EastEnders
© BBC

As they await the important call, Ronnie, Roxy, Linda and Shirley find themselves thrown together in The Vic, leading them to discuss Dean and everything that's happened.

As the ladies all open up about their feelings, they offer words of support to each other and Ronnie insists that Dean is the only person at fault.

Before long, the verdict is in, but with Linda fearing Dean will be found innocent, will her fears prove correct? Or will he be found guilty?

http://digitalspyuk.cdnds.net/16/31/768x512/gallery-1470577253-soaps-eastenders-deans-verdict-awaited-6.jpg
Linda Carter, Ronnie Mitchell and Roxy Mitchell discuss Dean Wicks's trial in EastEnders
© BBC

EastEnders airs these scenes on Monday August 15, Wednesday August 17, Thursday August 18 and Friday August 19 on BBC One.

Digital Spy

[Perdita]

There's a big fuss in the papers today about Dean Wicks's attempted rape trial taking place off screen in EastEnders - so what's the truth behind the tabloid tales?

Next week's episodes see the Carters and the Mitchells desperately hoping that justice will be served when Dean faces trial for his attack on Roxy, but we don't see the events in the courtroom for ourselves.

Instead, the focus is firmly on those affected by Dean's crimes as we see how the likes of Roxy, Ronnie, Linda and Shirley cope with the events of the emotional week.

That all sounds fair enough to us, but one newspaper report today (August 11) has suggested that the lack of courtroom scenes is actually down to EastEnders budget cuts - with bosses wanting to save on the costs of courtroom scenes and extras.

Hmm, but aren't there just as many extras in a packed-out Queen Vic or market scene? Suspecting there's more to it, we went to our own EastEnders sources for the inside scoop.

A Walford insider told Digital Spy: "The decision not to show Dean's trial on screen has nothing to do with budgets. There's a regular courtroom set at the studios which can be used in episodes at any time.

"Instead the decision was purely a storytelling one, as this is a survivors' story. Rather than telling the story from the perspective of the attacker, the episodes focus on the impact on Linda, Roxy, Ronnie, Shirley and their families.

"Friday's episode is particularly affecting as the women on the Square all wait for the verdict and support each other as they reveal their feelings about what happened.

"Kathy Beale also opens up over her own traumatic past when she tries to support Dean's dad Buster."

An EastEnders spokesperson also told us: "There were never any plans to show Dean's trial on screen. This has nothing to do with budgets but as viewers will see, the focus of the story is about the survivors of rape."


Digital Spy


This would explain why we don´t see anyone at the trial!

[tammyy2j]

I thought Angelo would have filmed some scenes for his trial before he left perhaps finally admitting his guilt and saying sorry to both Linda and Roxy

[kaz21]

I was hoping we would see it. Feel a bit cheated

[lizann]

innocent so much for dtc fitting ending and justice being served, liar

[lizann]

is he returning with shirley?

[Timalay]

I hope not, I didn't like the direction the charter was going.

[lizann]

online speculation dean returning as in cahoots with theo and ruby

[lizann]

back as gina's boyfriend latest online speculation

[lizann]

his return has been leaked

[Timalay]

I'm wondering if he's the mystery partner in the Pie and Mash shop.

[Dennis tanner]

I'm wondering if he's the mystery partner in the Pie and Mash shop.

The O'Wicks Pie and Mash shop.

[lizann]

I'm wondering if he's the mystery partner in the Pie and Mash shop.

yes he is also back as daughter jade is sick

[Perdita]

https://www.digitalspy.com/soaps/eastenders/a61596800/eastenders-matt-di-angelo-dean-wicks-exit/

Leaving

[Dennis tanner]

https://www.digitalspy.com/soaps/eastenders/a61596800/eastenders-matt-di-angelo-dean-wicks-exit/

Leaving Off to the Chokey for Life if I had my way !!!!

[lizann]

trial coming up